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Author Topic: World Government
jayred12
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In your opinion would a world governement be sucessful in todays society?
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TomDavidson
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Well, no. It would almost definitionally require tomorrow's society.
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TheDeamon
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It would require "tommorow's society" as Tom put it.

Too many people wanting to kill or otherwise oppress "the other guy" for it to work well right now... That and the majority of the world's population don't have the institutions in place that would be likely to make such a transition a desirable outcome for more developed "free" societies, as the lowest common denominator gets set at a much lower point while corruption runs amok.

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jayred12
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Do you believe if those institutions were put into place throughout the world, that a world governemnt would suceed then?
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TomDavidson
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That's a pretty big "if."
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JoshuaD
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quote:
Originally posted by jayred12:
Do you believe if those institutions were put into place throughout the world, that a world governemnt would suceed then?

What do you mean by "government"? Would it require that taxes be paid? Would current country-level governments have to sign on to this new world government?

What method of enforcement would it have? What would happen if I broke a "world law"? Where would be the prisons? How would the representatives be elected? Would it be involved in disputes amongst the world countries?


"World Government" is a nice, breezy term. Define it a little and you'll see that your question isn't the question you should be asking.

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jayred12
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Think of this world goverment like this...the world is like 1 huge country, each former country is like a state. These "states" would send representatives to the worlds capitol where they would represent their "state". Each "state" would have its own specific laws like a modern day state but would also have laws imposed by the world government just like the U.S. has laws for its states.These "states" would collect taxes and give them to the world government. Their would only be one enforcment group, an international police force. That should answer some of your questions.
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Aris Katsaris
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It wouldn't work in the current world, jayred -- there's currently too much ethnic, racial, and religious strife for the various nations to trust each other. Too much grievance at past wrongs to work together properly. Too much lingering imperialism and religious tyranny as well. Right now the momentum is towards splitting up, not coming together (Yugoslavia tore itself apart, Kosovo broke away with Western help, South Ossetia and Abkhazia broke away with Russian help, South Sudan will probably achieve independence, etc, etc)

The European Union is the closest we are to a international government of many nations; and even in that limited form, where every nation belongs in the same "civilization", have similar forms of governments, and belong supposedly to the same global pole (the 'west'), there's enough division and disstrust to threaten the whole construct.

I can conceive some regional governments coming into existence (EU, Arab League, etc) in this century but unless we're talking about some sort of technological Singularity where an ultra-intelligent artificial intelligence takes over the whole world, then no, no global government yet.

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TomDavidson
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There would need to be some compelling reason for nations with a significant amount of natural resources, manpower, and military strength to submit those resources to the control of others.
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Dave at Work
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How would this World Government balance the desires of some people to have freedom of speech and religion with the desires of other people to have laws based on a specific set of religious laws like Sharia for example? This is just one example of the type of conflicting views such a government would have to grapple with on a global scale. There are so many many more. With the world population nearing 7 billion and with so many differing value systems in conflict with one another how do you expect to shoehorn it all under one government without quickly finding the whole world in a civil war?
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jayred12
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Each "state" in this world gpovernment would have one set of laws. For example they would be all Muslim, or all Christian, etc. this way their would always be a place for specific groups to go
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TheRallanator
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The big problem with a world government is gonna be a practical one rather than an ideological one. You've gotta convince around 200 national governments (which in a lot of cases means convincing the general public) that they should give up their autonomy and many of their powers and agree to be led by a global organisation which won't always have the national interest at heart.

Europe (which is full of countries which are far more open to the idea of international organisations and far less paranoid and reactionary about it than America) has taken how many decades to get the EEC to evolve into the EU? The fact that it's taking a place like Europe so long just to empower a fairly loose regional association says a lot about the chances of ever getting a world government to float.

So yeah, I don't think world government is necessarily a bad thing, I just think that short of someone conquering the world it's an impossible thing.

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TomDavidson
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quote:
Each "state" in this world gpovernment would have one set of laws. For example they would be all Muslim, or all Christian, etc. this way their would always be a place for specific groups to go.
I can imagine no scenario in which this would work well.
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TheDeamon
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quote:
Originally posted by jayred12:
Each "state" in this world gpovernment would have one set of laws. For example they would be all Muslim, or all Christian, etc. this way their would always be a place for specific groups to go

I believe there are international treaties in place right now that would consider such actions to be either "genocide" or "ethnic cleansing."
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TheRallanator
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quote:
Originally posted by TomDavidson:
quote:
Each "state" in this world gpovernment would have one set of laws. For example they would be all Muslim, or all Christian, etc. this way their would always be a place for specific groups to go.
I can imagine no scenario in which this would work well.
Hey just look how well the partition of India worked!

Well okay maybe not. But the partition of Isr-...

The partition of Ireland?

Okay so maybe it won't work, but it sure sounds good on paper [Big Grin]

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JoshuaD
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quote:
Okay so maybe it won't work, but it sure sounds good on paper [Big Grin] [/QB]
Unfortunately, it doesn't even sound good on paper. It's an idealistic pipe dream that would have terrible repercussions if it ever managed to somehow be implemented.
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TheRallanator
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Hey it sounds great on paper. "Let's partition the place so X can live here and Y can live there" sounds like a much easier plan than "Okay let's find a way to make X and Y realise that they're both equally awesome".
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kmbboots
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Maybe it just doesn't work for countries that start with the letter I.
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socalledsophist
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What of a supranational alliance between the U.S., Russia, and China? Would that not do the trick just as easily as convincing the rest of the world to join a world government?

Seems to me that the establishment of a world government need only a monopoly of force, not a majority of consent. Find a way to bind those three superpowers and you will have the world government, for better or worse.

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Redskullvw
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Economically we do have a sort of World Government. I.E. look at a world map. Then plot out where you can purchase Coca Cola. Those places where you cant buy a coke are likely places that have limited trade on the world market for any products. Where you have full access to the world market of the 200 odd nations that participate in one way or another in the Dollar traded commodities, or the petro dollar/euro zones of influence- you have generally agreed upon and compatible legal trade systems. Those countries which dont agree to this legal trade system are pretty much backwaters like North Korea. The longer this system stays in place, the more codependent the economies become. It will not likely be possible to have a world government until such time as the economic needs of a nation state out grow its needs for traditional national economic activity and military controls.

SO for a vision of the future look at where global products acheive mass distribution. Coca Cola, McDonalds, Toyota- this is the leading edge of a development where legal systems, intellectual property law, personal property rights, and multinational trade agreements has allowed for the development and viability of world marketed products. The more markets develop, and the more codependent they become the more likely it is for political power to become focused on economic power and policy instead of military and nationalistic based policy. Give everything a shake and add a few hundred more years, and much of the world should have a defacto world government system.

Assuming of course we dont have wars where millions die each year across multiple conflicted theaters. Any war that includes a nuclear detonation will mean that you will likely not see a world government develop in the next 500 years.

Of course the aliens could land tomorrow and wed be stoneaged back to a point where anyone who is human would suddenly be your best ally- even if we could no longer do any of the stuff we currently can do with our current infrastructure.

Zombie apocalypse would have a similar effect.

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JShope
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There can never be effective World Government, until there is a majority of people who exercise Self Government.

When you have that, you can have successful free and representative government.

The only other option is a dictatorship, that governs through enslavement.

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