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DAStark
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I used to tell people that Orson Scott Card was unequivocally my favourite author, but today I have to alter that statement quite radically.

It was only four years ago that a trusted friend forced a copy of "Ender's Game" into my hands for the first time. "Ender's Game" as a title had been familiar, in fact, I had friends in highschool that had been in a band with that name, but Mr. Card...to me, he was new.

I quickly absorbed the entire Ender series, carefully moving on to "Pastwatch", "The Worthing Saga" and the Alvin Maker series, respectively. Without a doubt, there is no other fictional writer that captivates me like Mr. Card has, and will continue to do.

Recently, a personal infatuation with graphic novels allowed me to make another discovery...Mr. Card had also been commissioned a year ago to write for Marvel Comics' Ultimate Iron Man. My jaw hit the floor. My excitement increased, vowing to pick up the trade paperback edition ASAP.

To hold myself over until that time, I decided to search for more information about Mr. Card, the state of the "Ender's Game" motion-picture, and to see if there were plans in the works for additional collaboration with comics (Alvin Maker confirmed this search).

It was at this point when I stumbled upon "World Watch", a weekly article by my favourite (*please note, I am Canadian, and this is how we spell favourite) author. More precisely, I was allowed to read his various opinions (and they are truly just opinions) on many topics of debate.

I wasn't offended by the views expressed by Mr. Card, but I found very little in his various opinions that I could truly identify with. I choose not to enter a debate about the facts, or even the claimed 'irrefutable-facts' that were expressed, but only state that they were often in contradiction to my own personal schema.

As I read on, I could find some points of opinion where Mr. Card and I basically had similar perspectives, but they were so few and far between that I sadly had to concede that I could no longer refer to Mr. Card as my favourite author. To say this would be denying an entire body of work created by Mr. Card that I cannot relate to, wouldn't recommend to any reader, and generally find to be dripping with nationalism, arrogance, and allegory.

This is by no means an attack on his views, his right to express such views, or his fictional work. I definitely owe the man many thanks. If it weren't for his books, I would probably have remained in my little world of non-fiction, happily learning. He brought a tone of imagination back into my reading material (*although some can argue that since I was reading hundreds of documents created by the CIA, DIA, State Dept., et al, that I was already getting enough of a dose of imaginative/fictional writing!).

The point is: don't ever hold anyone higher than your heart.

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kelcimer
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Well, take heart.

You are not the first to be disappointed in OSC.

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Kent
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yawn
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kenmeerilritorne
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quote:
yawn
My what bored teeth you have, granny!
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Kent
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I've missed you kenmeer, good to have you back.
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kenmeerilritorne
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God to be on deck for a bit.
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kenmeerilritorne
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Oops. I meant GOOD to be on deck a bit.
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Redskullvw
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Ahh now it all makes sense now as to why these threads all re animated.
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kenmeerilritorne
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quote:
why these threads all re animated.
Intelligent redesign.
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Daruma28
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It is with great sadness that I have now thrown out all of my books, DVDs and CDs because not one of the artists, authors, actors, scriptwriters and creators match my own personal social and political viewpoints.

Oh the joy that is uniformity of thought.

I'll take my Kool Aid now, Mr. Jones.

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theyux
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The fact that he is so far right wieng that he thinks Fox is a moderate channel. Doesnt mean he isnt an excellent author. Look at his essays they are full B.S. and yet he sells them well. he is a fantastice writer
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AaronTraas
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Fox is fairly moderate. It just seems right compared to the bias of the rest of the media.

Check what people used to mean by conservative and liberal 20 years ago. Bush is actually far to the left of Reagan, and few at the time considered Reagan an extremist. Pope Benedict as well... he was refered to by many in the 70's as a liberal, and now he's considered a staunch conservative by all but the most conservative of Catholics. Over the past 15 years, the far left has redefined "extreme conservative" to mean anything right of the far left.

By moderate, Card doesn't mean Fox News is unbiased. No news source is unbiased. The problem is "moderate" is a difficult thing to define. There are specific issues that most people classify as either conservative or liberal. The reality is that most people don't go down the line on one side or the other. It's usually an issue-based approach, and in respect to individual issues, few people are really in the middle of an issue.

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theyux
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Moderate would be MSNBC. They arent left and right they are pure fact. And very dull. Thier you have it. The vast left media is more sensationalist media. Jay Leno made fun of Bush and Kerry. And he made jokes at Bill for years.

You think if a super left wing liberal was elected, John Stewart would quit his job, because he has no more material. I really doubt that. He would just switch tracks. Because his job is to be funny.

And you are completely right. 30 years ago, America was by an large was right wing.

Christianity has been dropping down in popularity. The Democrats saw a way in. They became the group that doesnt care what religion you are. And Republicans, still bieng the vast majority, Became more actively christian.

As far as orsons policy of believing that the left is now the majority. (in power)

Well that is plain stupid (Having the intelligence to deduce a problem, but willingly ingoring it.) Republicans have all but the federal courts. (and even then they will probably have that before bush leaves).

The reason why they havent been able to keep heading right even farther, is because enough of the population has become liberal. Its no longer tree hugging hipees its intellectuals.

Not just listening to rhetoric (liberal or republican) that put a stop to it.

this is a waste of time, people are still stuck in the mental trap that they have to be one way or another.

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kenmeerilritorne
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I've said this before: for everyone to have heard about 'liberal bias' in the media requires a significant part of the media to declare the topic. For what it's worth, I first heard the liberal media bias in full meme on NPR. It was, I;m sure, guts like Rush who first spread this meme's seeds, but the demonic liberal media reported this enough that, by 1994, I was well aware of it from media sources deemed liberal.

Interestingly enough, they neither disputed nor confirmed it. They asked for input.

Anywa, whatever liberal bias the media has or had, it has allowed itself to be tar-brushed by its own hand as liberally-biased, with tar provided by decidedly conservatively biased sources.

Something to ponder.

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TheDeamon
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quote:
Originally posted by theyux:
Moderate would be MSNBC. They arent left and right they are pure fact. And very dull. Thier you have it. The vast left media is more sensationalist media. Jay Leno made fun of Bush and Kerry. And he made jokes at Bill for years.

I dunno, I stopped watching the news feeds a couple years ago. But at the time, MSNBC seemed pretty Liberal to me. But then I consider myself a moderate politically, though others I know who identify themselves as Democrats will say I'm a Republican in everything but name.

Fox News is a little bit the right side of the political spectrum, but not by much. But then, I get a reasonably good exposure to the truely right wing material that is out there on a fairly regular basis. Which probably puts me at different perspective from most other people who only socialize with Liberal Democrats and otherwise politically moderate people who identify themselves as Republicans for lack of anything else to identify as.

quote:
You think if a super left wing liberal was elected, John Stewart would quit his job, because he has no more material. I really doubt that. He would just switch tracks. Because his job is to be funny.
And has been the job of every comic throughout the history of TV comics. Johnny Carson cracked joked about LBJ, Nixon, Ford, Carter, Reagon, and George Bush. Jay Leno cracked jokes about George H. W. Bush(though mostly about Dan Quayle), Bill Clinton, and G. W. Bush. Their job isn't to be partisian, their job is to be funny with the material that relevant to the news of the day... Which often involves the PotUS.

quote:
And you are completely right. 30 years ago, America was by an large was right wing.
The America of 30 years ago was left wing compared to the America of 60 years ago... What exactly is your point with this? Don't belive me, dig up political commentary from the period. The political spectrum has been noticeably shifting to the left since Teddy Rosevelt was President of the United States.

quote:
As far as orsons policy of believing that the left is now the majority. (in power)
They are, but they aren't. They control all but the Supreme Court in the Judicial system, they have a reasonable amount of power in congress thanks to the more moderate Republicans in office. They(the Democrats) are also many, MANY times better at pulling the politcal cards I despise most. Irrational emotional appeals: "If we let the Republicans do this, children will starve!" And the race card: "Republicans don't care about Black/Hispanic/Asian/Other) People, if you vote for them, and have that ethnicity, you are hurting yourselves."

The only cards I've noticed the Republicans pulling is: Religion, and Common Sense.

...too bad as anybody who works in the safety industry will tell you, "'common sense' isn't that common."

quote:
this is a waste of time, people are still stuck in the mental trap that they have to be one way or another.
And people are inherently more concerned about their short term interests than they are about their(or anyone elses) long term ones...

To the point of expecting the US Government to worry about the long term for them and others. Funding their retirement(Social Security, Medicare/Medicaid), helping fund local infrastructure, helping feed/clothe the needy(welfare), provide them with a financial safety net in the event they find themselves unemployed(umemployment) rather than building up a finicial nest egg of their own to tide themselves over... Which virtually every finaincial advisor I've ever met will tell people to do anyway.

The combination of these two problems(people wanting to look at issues as black and white, and the short term "what's in it for me?") together are the single biggest contributing factors to most of the problems the United States of America has.

[ March 08, 2006, 03:24 PM: Message edited by: TheDeamon ]

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DAStark
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quote:
Originally posted by Daruma28:
It is with great sadness that I have now thrown out all of my books, DVDs and CDs because not one of the artists, authors, actors, scriptwriters and creators match my own personal social and political viewpoints.

Oh the joy that is uniformity of thought.

Actually, since making my recent discovery about OSC I've bought another five products bearing his authorship. So, while your point was cute, it missed the mark.

Simply stated, my entire purpose was only to say: "I can't believe that Orson Scott Card really believes the kind of things that he does." Period.

Does this detract from my opinion of his fictional work? Definitely not! In fact, I probably think OSC is much more talented in the realm of fiction than I had previously thought, since he's able to write fiction with such an open and logical mind; a characteristic that I see so little of this in his social commentaries, or op. ed. pieces.

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javelin
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quote:
since he's able to write fiction with such an open and logical mind; a characteristic that I see so little of this in his social commentaries, or op. ed. pieces.
And that is kinda funny, too.
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KnightEnder
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LOL! Very witty Daruma

KE

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Everard
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Perhaps it is funny javelin, but... true, nonetheless. If there's an open mind behind his essay's, its very carefully hidden so as to leave no trace, in most of them.
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Redskullvw
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Aaron

you post was one of the best summations about this topic ever posted on Ornery.

I think you are a member who is not only welcome, but also right in his first post.

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Californio
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I am stunned that someone would read OSC's books and then be utterly unprepared for his views as expressed herein. Did we read the same books? The entire premise of Ender's Game (to me) was the cost, to an individual, of being subjected to, and who chose to be subjected to, a personal regime' that was very demanding - soul crushingly so....but it all had a POINT. Would you feel better if the main character in the book lit up a french cigarette (Gaulouse? sp? - Gal-Whah) slouched against a bulkhead - shrugged his shoulders, put on a beret, and with a sneer said "Why bother, man is nothingness hurtling toward oblivion." ? A good book is a good book.

When did the "progressives" become the modern Puritans? Dogmatic, judgmental, with a white-knuckled grip on the one true path to enlightenment - The reality based community that is in love with deconstruction - can you see the cracks in the fascade yet? Wow! Political salavation - only through their priest class, of course! Scorn the myths of gods, etc. These are heretical to the one True God - TRUTH - which, they will tell you, they solely define.. and it is a moving, subjective target! Better just let them "tell" you what to do.

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Mabus
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Welcome to Ornery, Californio.

You are...um...wrong. I think. *tries to get head around what the newbie is saying*

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halfhaggis
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DAStark: Just tell everyone that OSC is unequivocally your favourite *speculative fiction* author.
Not really a radical alteration, just a categorisation.

No more moral dilemma. [Smile]

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