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Author Topic: "P. J. Hoff" by Kenmeer Livermaile
KnightEnder
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This thread is for discussion and critique of Kenmeer Livermaile's story "P. J. Hoff" (KL's first submission).

[ April 08, 2005, 12:19 PM: Message edited by: KnightEnder ]

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kenmeer livermaile
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Actually, it's titled "P.J. Hoff". I think the phrase 'god in the machine' was an obscure note to myself at the end of the text. I have no idea now why I even put that note into the text.

But then, P.J.Hoff was just a quirky label I attached to it so I could find the file. While the subject matter has its demiurgic concepts, I doubt the word 'god' fits comfortably in its subject matter [Wink]

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Adam Lassek
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posted March 27, 2005 01:45 AM
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@KL: Wow. You really have a way with words (bald ferret taking a nap. Hah! ). A little reminiscent of Tom Robbins.

Judging by the notes at the end, I eagerly await the rest of the story.

(P.S. your story reminded me of this USENET post I think you'll enjoy.)

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kenmeer livermaile
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posted March 27, 2005 11:50 AM
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"(P.S. your story reminded me of this USENET post I think you'll enjoy.)"

I am writing a sex scene and my hero is now crossing the room while fully erect. So, basically, his stiff dick is bobbing like a demented conductors baton as he crosses the room ... however, one cannot simply write, 'He crossed the room, his stiff dick bobbing like ... '

I am ALWAYS painfully, murderously jealous when someone shows such facility for description. Yet I salvage my pride when I realise they, too, tend to waste their prowess flaunting same.

Fact is, his first simile was right on. A demented conductor's baton indeed. Couple that with Chant 'boingy, boingy, boingy' as he
approaches and it makes a perfect wrap. If one thinks an aspect of an event is ludicrous by nature, describe it as such. A reader can easily relate to the absurdity of being naked and horny and insanely attracted to these bizarre body parts, and can slather the following action with lust if the writer lets them:

'He stopped in front of her, proudly embarrassed, his dick throbbing now not from his stride but from a heart rate approaching hysteria.

'Her bemusement transformed into serious lust.' (A little study here could make this a facial event to focus the reader's POV onto the fella, or could enter her consciousness indirectly by focusing on her apparent enjoyment of the following): 'She slurped him in and the thing commenced. He wanted to watch but true surrender required he close his eyes. Just as well. She'd forgotten he was there.'

My feeling for erotica is that it is best described hit and run. 'Words get in the way', so one slings a string of descriptives, then states a few facts ('She slurped him in and the thing commenced'), then perhaps make a few oblique observations on the way to afterglow. Make the reader hard/wet and then shut up.

Funny. I don't normally write sex/love. I'm generally more abstract. But pornographic writing introduced me to 'fine writing'. While I grew up a bookworm, and had read by 8th my share of Twain and Heinlein and what high school curricula taught as literature (To Kill A Mockingbird, Catcher in the Rye stuff), it wasn't until I was a sophomore that I grabbed a big black book off the library shlef (I was at an age where size mattered). The book promptly opened to sa dirty passage, and I was enthralled by the combination of eros and magical language. Nabokov's ADA, chapter 19.

Here is Nabokov's description of key penile behavior:

The tall clock struck an anonymous quarter, and Ada was presently watching, cheek on fist, the impressive, though oddly morose, stirrings, steady clockwise launch, and ponderous upswing of virile revival.

Now THAT'S a demented conductor's baton resurrecting itself from the dead...

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KnightEnder
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kenmeer livermaile
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posted March 27, 2005 06:09 PM
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"I also recommend that you send in your email or on the text of your stories YOUR questions for your readers. For instance, what worries you? With what are you still struggling? With what part are you most satisfied? This will give your readers a place to focus. And I suspect we might need this when pieces start coming in quickly and furiously."

For mine, I wonder where I'll take it. It's been months since I've touched it, so I;ve lost sight of the will o'the wisp one follows through the narrative swamp. This doesn't mean I can't navigate to the stories end, but having to break out a compass and sextant and make 'trigonemetric readings' to reclaim my last bearings is DULL. SO I'm hoping that others might offer a flash of what they think should happen to my hero, his wife, and his lovely succubus. Any suggestions are recommended to ignore my notes to myself... UNLESS one jumps out and grabs ye.

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Richard Dey
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posted March 27, 2005 11:19 PM
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This is a critique of I think KL's untitled 'scene-lay' ooops sorry, 'scream-play' oops sorry, whatever it is :

There are few plots I enjoy more than ‘man’s sex life goes to rack and ruin’. In this one, Galatea the sexpotbot drives Pygmalion ... [plot incomplete].

Dream and fantasy sequencing is very difficult. This one is using tenses almost at random where I think it would be much improved if tenses were used 'deliberately' to facilitate the illusions created by or for a sexually dissatisfied husband. Such is very difficult writing. Here the statue with which the artist falls in love becomes a pornographic icon. Optional endings are provided but, since they are not in obligatory [brackets] , I can only presume that they are author's notes for continuation rather than opus pars.

Many interesting evocations of the male visual sexuality (a sex-specific function).

The colloquial language needs to be more-artfully laid out to prevent making the process even more complicated grammatically than it is psychologically. Another difficult task -- and not another one that editors will take on for free (!).

Excellent imagery, but several need polishing.

churchyards still survived indicates that it won’t for long?
women’s elbow SR woman’s elbow
“I was walking the fog.” Nice pathetic fallacy. Is that Morrison?
last name was Moore SR were
stud wishing a SR stud wishing that a (yes it is the main character speaking but
it’s followed by a long compound dependent clause w/o a cause)
sound of him breathing SR his (not his voice)
“The optical focus has reversed from many eyes seeing the one or at most few,
to one or at most few seeing the many.” There’s a good image hiding here, but
not in this unfocused rendition.
“... he would see hallucinations, in the dark, of ...” to see hallucinations is
redundant; has he been bonked on the head, see double in concusion? Also, the
commas, even if breathers, ‘do not further the text’ (I urp up at the phrase, so do
leave them in!). Actually, I see no reason to clarify this whole paragraph; the
reader isn’t having the hallucinations, he is.
The same happens in the overture of the next paragraph. In the process of
losing control of his wand, the music gets confused in tenses and sources. If you
are suggesting that he’s lost control, now is the time to suggest to whom it is
being lost or you run the risk of having the images (per se) become the
motivators. That is the pathetic fallacy. If the pathetic fallacy IS the motivator,
then now you ought to hint that. (Object takes over Subject as in *The Invasion of
the Snatcher Bodies or whatever it was.) You refer to ‘the sirens of pornography’;
is that whom you are suggesting as the animator/snatchers? Whatever, this is a
pivotal scene and ought to reflect that.
sated. For they were (the preposition here is just distracting, really has to go)

(he see her ...) Why the lowercase paragraph?
offers wisdom (insights?)
to damage. This isn’t right. that could damage?
reader’s SR readers’
Women don’t ‘prefer’ foreplay; they have multiple orgasms during foreplay and husband just won’t give them to her after he's got is one? (and, indeed, why should he!!!)
“... thoroughly, if not addicted than at least diligently committed, to’” This is more
convoluted than jerking off at the office .
“... it would not try and” is just a provincialism, and, if you switch to “... it would
not try to” you aggravate the pathetic fallacy (i.e., that the computer is taking over
his mind -- by offering greater satisfaction than his wife? Is that where this is going?). Ditto “knew him as only a password”. This is the deus ex machina fallacy --...-- but I TRUST you ...!
men’s room (check this search area)
he would prefer no SR he would prefer that no
enough. But SR enough, but
“... to try a different something different.” ?
feather bed SR feather-bed (modifying trampoline)
and advocated SR and had advocated
ensorcelled!
peep show or Peep Show (choose one)

This has great promise -- but a caveat. Using pinwheels to suggest a descent into madness may be gone, and using sexual objectification as an objectified provocateur is not novel (there is the famous statue, you know!), I know of none that used the time factor successfully. Therefore, if tenses are going to be merely fluid, you will drive the reader crazy before before you drive the protagonist crazy; and there is always the danger of turning your protagonist into an antagonist. Of course I should prefer is becoming a hero, but in that you have set a high and difficult task in a feminist age! Pornography offends females; that part of the brain is missing; it doesn’t serve their reproductive purposes. I would play that out.

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KnightEnder
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kenmeer livermaile
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posted March 28, 2005 07:20 PM
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"Therefore, if tenses are going to be merely fluid, you will drive the reader crazy before before you drive the protagonist crazy; and there is always the danger of turning your protagonist into an antagonist."

Tenses usually give me grief because, I think, I tend to write stories in stories from a protagonsit's point of view. Which also perhaps explains my other great tripping point: I LIKE to intrude the author into the tale. I'm breaking the habit but only because other folks don't like it.

Nabokov did it a lot and I always liked feeling his herring-bone wool shoulder rub against mine.

BY the way, what does SR mean?

"Pornography offends females; that part of the brain is missing; it doesn’t serve their reproductive purposes. I would play that out."

Aye. I think this story is for the likes of Playboy, not Ms. (Although, once they got into it a ways, they would enjoy seeing the fella fall drowning in his own onanism.

Pornography offends females but erotica is their secret love. Pornography is a golemization of prostitution, while erotica, yea, even erotice involving moving pictures of couples getting it on, is a telling of a very lovely but 'dirty' story.

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kenmeer livermaile
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posted March 28, 2005 07:22 PM
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"I already know you can write; what we need is a synopsis."

I tell myself that all the time, RD. Synopses escape me. I swim through the fog with the greatest of difficulty...

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Richard Dey
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posted March 29, 2005 12:14 PM
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Tenses.

Nothing I have more trouble with than tenses -- and very much for the same reason all great writers like ourselves have trouble with them. We try to get inside the brains of the characters we're delineating, only to discover that they're sense of time is like Lucille Ball trying to get cakes from an assembly line into boxes, trying to make plans for the future now in the present using things that happened in the past.

Now, you remember in Canadian's taut text how we were thrown into 'the simple life' of 'the simple folk' by 'the simple tactic' of using 'the simple sentence'. I was catapulted into the simple world of the half-ton truck, the red-plaid hunting jacket, and the trailer camp; for me, this is as exotic as Shangri-La, and I am always a sucker for low life and Hammet. Honestly, I think Canadian did a better job with his short lines than Golding did in *Lord of the Flies (which I still think was a bad book that went worse).

Your situation is MUCH more complicated because the situation itself is playing a leading role.

I think I mentioned the issue of vanity. On this pivot, there is no equality between the sexes; it really isn't allowed. When an actress is vain, we adore it; when an actor is vain, we find it a disgusting joke. Pornography is a fascinating example of this inequality in the sexes and why the inequality is not only accepted but ENFORCED.

If I suggested -- like some right-wing Christian -- that vanity in women is disgusting, RB would jump up and declare me a misogynist! If I were to suggest that Mr Trump's vanity is legitimate and, perhaps, underplayed, OPL would LOL at me! It's a very touchy subject

-- and here you've decided to sit on the knife-edge of a critical human failing: the very Massada of sexual equality: the aesthetic. To equalize the feminine and masculine aesthetic, classical Greeks had to ban women from the theatre, the stadium, and almost everything of importance to western civilization!

Here you have the chance to equalize female vanity and male self-indulgence -- and you've got this guy with (1) a willing wife and (2) an affordable prostitute, beginning to prefer a 3rd choice of sexual satisfaction which is, frankly, a virtually untested vehicle. The Christian right wing -- and Orthodox rabbis who stick their little things into holes in a sheet to have sex, may well consider this dangerous thinking and potentially blasphemous.

You know full well that my major charity is research into multiple orgasms for males. It's the only serious effort for world peace that I contribute to, actually.

I am not saying, KL, that you don't have a right to use all the tenses in a single sentence** -- if you think that will further the text; I'm just wondering how the movie version is going to act it out. As a director, I'd be completely confused -- and reach for the pinwheels.

My assumption here is that the hero is seeking absolutely lucidity by experiencing absolute bliss, i.e., a high level of orgasmic intensity unassailed by competition, pain, hunger, fear, dread (and all those fun things). Why else was it made so brief?

** "I shot him, and then had second thoughts because now I know that tomorrow I will be having regrets in the electric chair -- if, of course, I don't get a miracle call from Albany." One MIGHT consider that that furthers the story, but I'm still saying that in the degeneration of your character the tenses should be used intentionally -- ESPECIALLY if they can be used at the end of the story to reconstruct him.

Of your choices, BTW, whether his onanism (1) leads to a lightyear in hell with hair on his palms, (3) whether he's cured of it by his wife and the gynobot having a lesbian affair, or (3) whether his onanism leads him to solipsistic autogenesis and supreme genius, I have no clue yet. That's another reason I need an outline or synopsis. An editor needs to know, in 2nd reading, if the tenses, vocabulary, characterization, et al., are playing their respective roles in the purpose of the text. Red herrings are derigueur but in the final edit they need to be seen as such.

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kenmeer livermaile
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posted March 29, 2005 01:06 PM
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I think that for me the tenses will be most practically worked out by rewriting the thing in small single clause sentences, then reconstructing from there.

Whereas before I was so enraptured, by the fact that I could pull compelling images and situations forth from my brain, that I could scarcely change a jot or tittle and instead would pile more and more and... now I think I'm finally confident that my muse (that dumb broad) really does love me. Thus I'm willing to tear a thing apart without it tearing my heart apart.

In so doing, I should be able to make more effective linkages between temporal points of view.

Either way, I had GREAT fun inventing the crankonanic pecker peepers... my fave touch in the whole thing is him being surprised in his dream by the object of his dream and standing there with his little knobby-horse dangling by it's bridle...

Regarding tenses: the opening sentences betray this discomfort:

"Alone after hours at the office, Jack had dreamed
himself to sleep at his computer. Hand on his hard-on, head in his hard drive, he’d ejaculated into a handkerchief and promptly fallen asleep. The movie, fellatio porn, continued on for several minutes until its scenes deflated."

It occurs to me that the only reason I wrote "had dreamed' rather than 'dreamed' is because I was seeing it from the perspective of the dream. I already saw him asleep and waking up to a winking succubus. I betray MY sense of temporal perspective as a writer than the actual temporality of the tale?

So:

"Alone after hours at the office, Jack dreamed
himself to sleep at his computer. Hand on his hard-on, head in his hard drive, he ejaculated into a handkerchief and promptly fell asleep. The movie, fellatio porn, continued on for several minutes until its scenes deflated."

Works just as well, eh?

Thanks, RD, I think I learned something here. I think tenses will work much better from here on. I owe you. I'll share MOna with you, OK? She's really sweet;)

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Richard Dey
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posted March 31, 2005 12:44 PM
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KL: Yes, yes, and yes! (And use the perfect tenses perfectly -- so the reader can comprehend what state of undress, duress, and success he's in .

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RickyB
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posted April 01, 2005 02:31 AM
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KL, just finished your story (well, about 85% of one, to pick a nit) last night. Sorry it took a while.

I loved what there is, but I'll beg to be excused of addressing the notes, at this point anyway. I have no doubt you shop at the finest groceries and butchers, and use only the freshest produce. Show me dinner and I'll comment on it at length.

Reminded me of a story written by this woman I know, called "Loretta, Whore of the Revolution". If she ever finds the english version and allows me, I'll send it to you.

It's long, so I'll have to skim it again for mistakes and stuff. Didn't really notice any glaring ones the first time over, though. I love the fact that you use Morrison (that's the unreconstructed counter-culturenick in me). However, your choice of quotes, and your context, is sophisticated enough to enjoy without feeling it's guilty pleasure, the way you might enjoy something very dated or cheesy. Then again, I always did take JM seriously as a poet (Hell, I seriously contend the Bob Dylan is the most important English language poet of the 20th century, but the truth is that I'm not really into most poetry. I appreciate poetry the most when it's woven into proze or set to music).

Anyway, very good stuff. Very interesting thoughts. Gimme more.

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kenmeer livermaile
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posted April 01, 2005 10:14 AM
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"I love the fact that you use Morrison (that's the unreconstructed counter-culturenick in me). However, your choice of quotes, and your context, is sophisticated enough to enjoy without feeling it's guilty pleasure, the way you might enjoy something very dated or cheesy. Then again, I always did take JM seriously as a poet"

I was pleasantly saurprised to dicover how fine a poet Jim was, since The Doors were, in my opinion, rather pedestrian (with a few outstanding accomplishments, to be sure).

I used his quotes as brain pitons to point the way up a sheer cliff of ploit whose summit still remains out of sight.

I've got to settle down and critique yours and candian's efforts tonight. I've been having too much fun swinging on Ornery's monkey bars. Time to get serious. (sound of chimpanzee howling and smashing typewriter onto floor repeatedly...)

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Daruma28
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posted April 05, 2005 08:43 PM
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OK KL - very interesting story. My only critique is that this reads like a XXX version of a Readers Digest story that constantly intersects facts and social commentary with the story...but in your case, it makes it a little bit hard to get a good grasp of the narrative - almost like you cannot make up your mind on whether you want to tell a story or give us a Psych 101 lecture on pornography and it's effects on a person's sexual pshyche and marital relations.

Very compelling portrayal, but a tad bit confusing. I realize you are using this kind of approach to employ a non-conventional device for telling your story...but IMHO, it tends to distract and detract instead of move the narrative along.

However, I do like your mini-dissertation...the paragraph that starts with: "Pornography is the secret sharer. There are persons who view pornography together, but they are the
minority. Pornography is for the individual, alone in a sexual shell."

That whole sequence just seems to be the lecture part I referred to earlier, crammed into the middle of a narrative of your fiction. Maybe you could try and incorporate it into the storyline, rather than have it "interrupt" the story.

Perhaps your character visits a psychologist or researches porn addiction online or something?

BTW - I now see why JL had to send out a warning about some submissions being offensive...I wasn't, but I can certainly see why some may be.

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kenmeer livermaile
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posted April 05, 2005 11:39 PM
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"almost like you cannot make up your mind on whether you want to tell a story or give us a Psych 101 lecture on pornography and it's effects on a person's sexual pshyche and marital relations. "

Not "almost" but EXACTLY. In fact, my favorite reading crosses boundaries IN THE SAME TEXT, going from non-fiction and back. Borges is the classic template for this, and I don't know if anyone's bested him at this yet.

I LIKE disrupted dreams. Not saying it's a good approach to story-telling, but it's kind of how I am. A cross I have to carry. I'll get there.

A standard method of getting around this is to place the 'out of place' part in quotes and ascribe it to an imaginary lecturer. Sci-fi revels in this technqiue. It doesn't seem to disrupt the narrative nearly so much, for there's an understanding about sci-fi that it isn't REALLY supposed to be real. It's a story about a world that doesn't exist, while mainstream fiction is about a world that DOES exist, or did at the time of the writing.

Historical fiction does this sometimes too.

What's interesting is that in sci-fi, the lecturer is usually a fictional character from the same imaginary world (although sometimes a real lecturer is used as a prophetic voice of the past).

In historical fiction the historian can be contemporary but is usually some ancient cat like Plutarch.

"Perhaps your character visits a psychologist or researches porn addiction online or something?"

Ah, I see. At first I thought you were suggesting ways of continuing the plot; but you're suggesting ways of inserting the 'lecture'? Excellent. I'd probably have to adjust the 'lecturer's voice to distinguish it from 'my', the author's, voice. Oh, that always hurts so much. I'm sure you've noticed that I love the sound of my own voice. I've worked so hard on it, after all. Not that vanity isn't its own reward...

"Does Speculative Fiction mean the same thing as Science Fiction, because OSC seems to use them interchangeably?"

I first heard the term 'spec fiction' used by Harlan Ellison, who is the only true live sci-fi author I've ever seen in the flesh. Lecture at a Michigan State University.

Of course, ALL fiction is speculative.

The honest term would be 'paranormal' or 'magical' fiction. The reason sci-fi and fantasy are so incestuous is that they both want to change the behavior of some aspect of physics. Sci-fi explains the aberration by mad scientists and secret corporate research; fantasy goes straight for the magical jugular.

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canadian
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posted April 06, 2005 12:41 AM
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I'm going to read your story in the next couple days, KL. I started it yesterday but was rudely interrupted by a huge apartment fire two blocks up the road.

From what I've read so far, I do get a nice Harlan Ellison vibe...and definitely some Philip Jose Farmer ("Riders of the Purple Wage" comes to mind).

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kenmeer livermaile
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posted April 06, 2005 11:37 AM
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"("Riders of the Purple Wage" comes to mind)."

HA! For all that I come across as a big sci-fi fan, I've really lost touch with it since the late 70s. But I DID read Purple Wage way back in junior high, and it DID make an impression on me. In a sense, Farmer first introduced me to moder highbrow lit via that story's allusions.

If anything, I see myself picking up the style that Thomas Disch exemplified before he quit the biz.

But aside from Gibson (whose style IS exquisite but also insular), I wish I could write like the lady known as James Triptree, Jr. most of all. (When it comes to dealing with sci-fi memes, anyway.)

If one wished to see the kind of short story I most rever and slavishly imitate underneath it all, Nabokov's 'Signs and Symbols' or 'Lance' or 'Time and Ebb'. The first deals with madness from an excruciatingly tender perspective yet takes a very satisfying delight in depicting the madness, with memorable tropes like:

"Some of the spies are detached observers, such as glass surfaces and still ponds; others, such as coats in store windows, are prejudiced witnesses, lynchers at heart..."

The latter two treat (with both gentleness and wry contempt) themes that are generally labeled 'science fictional'.

I like stories that intrude the fantastic in ways that both delight in their own fantasticality (the aesthetics of the beautifully grotesque) and create, in the end, something like a happy ending.

I think the most perfect example of the boundaries of reality I wish to probe is the movie K-Pax, which nicely suspends ourt disbelief in both alien messiah figures and Terran [sychotic tragic figures, and weaves healing miracles from both.

The Fisher King is an equally apt example.

Harlan? On a good day, he's amazing. On a bad day, he's an overblown hack. Gotta love him though. (For an example o a writer's AWFUL beginnings, dig up an early 60s book he wrote about 'teen gangs', one he researched by jpoining the gang itself. Apparently, he looked very younf for his age.)

Farmer's most famous work, the Riverworld series, showed how a talkented writer could take a magnificent concept and terrific novel and disintegrate it in the space of a few sequels. Couldn't bring myself to finish it. I should dig up a critique I made of Gibson wat back wehn -- IF I can find it.

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posted June 24, 2005 02:03 PM
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If this already has a thread, I couldn't find it.

Okay, the fact that I'm commenting on this story now just goes to show how far behind I am.

First:

I loved this! I was so disappointed when I saw that it was truncated. I skimmed over the outline for the rest and I have to say, I think more is captured with the WRITING than the plot.

I loved the slow unfolding of the plot, the action simply serving as a framework upon which social and psychological commentary could be hung. The 'rants' were mesmerizing. A story all about asides, this really got my attention and spawned many of my own musings. Whaddya know? A story that actually made me think.

The marriage relationship was so well crafted, I believed every moment of it. We don't discuss it much, but the marriage really does exist in the bedroom. Without it, you're just good friends...or not as the case may be.

The fact that I like it, and that every woman I know will like this story makes it a winner purely on the popularity scale, but what I really dig is that it evoked memories of Poor J.Alfred Prufrock and his sadistic creator, TS Eliot; the tragic heroes of Ellison, the casual wantoness of Philip Jose Farmer, the navel gazing of Frank Herbert and the dreamlike exposition of William Gibson...wow.

Criticisms?

I guess I'd like some of the meandering to tighten up a bit. I'm a bit of a faux 'literati' in that I enjoy the construction of themes that twist diabolically into my consciousness and I felt the stirrings of such in the tale, but to have a little more refinement of this subtle manipulation of symbols and themes would suit me just fine.

I know that some readers have remarked on the ambling, rambling prose, but I thought it fit perfectly. As hade of stream of consciousness, but pulled back just enought to be sensible and keep the reader guessing. All that verbiage sets up a great contrast between disclosure and obfuscation.

I can't wait for the rest.

[ June 24, 2005, 03:13 PM: Message edited by: canadian ]
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canadian
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hmm..re-reading this thread, I see I have repeated some of my comparisons. I must believe them..

[Wink]

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kenmeer livermaile
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For the record, I finally continued this piece a few days ago.

Also, since I forgot to elsewhere, let me comment on canadian's latest: again, impressive. My only negative hint is that there's a certain claustrophobia to your settings. For the most part, that's good: it;s a fairly claustrophobic tale anyway, what with clinging girlfriends and seemingly inescapable repeated fate.

But I think that if you went through and, at key nodes, injected some of that vast Albertan sky or what have you, it would give a certain... something to an already impressive tale.

"I loved the slow unfolding of the plot, the action simply serving as a framework upon which social and psychological commentary could be hung. The 'rants' were mesmerizing. A story all about asides, this really got my attention and spawned many of my own musings. Whaddya know? A story that actually made me think."

I seem to live in 'asides', pondering. I;m working on 'tightening things up'

"I loved the slow unfolding of the plot, the action simply serving as a framework upon which social and psychological commentary could be hung. The 'rants' were mesmerizing. A story all about asides, this really got my attention and spawned many of my own musings. Whaddya know? A story that actually made me think."

Hey, you can tell me **** like that ANYtime. Which reminds me: time to see if Jay got that Andy G. copied for ye.

And time I read some more Ornery fiction. Seeing different talents in different styles achieve different results, the success or lack of them depending less on inherent talent or even style but on sheer conviction by the author in their own tale, has been really growthful for me.

I realize ye can't write anything but what ye can write.

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kenmeer livermaile
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Anyway, the next scene is the guy's wife talking to her counselor.
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