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» The Ornery American Forum » General Comments » Miscellaneous Chat - Part 2 (Page 2)

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Author Topic: Miscellaneous Chat - Part 2
Everard
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Some of those are definetely dissaproval. Others are just rabbits being rabbits [Smile] You can tell by the ear state. If the pink of the ear is facing forward, there is no disapproval happening. One ear forward and one ear back is mild disapproval. Pinks of both ears to the side is "I'm busy." ears flat against the back is serious disapproval.
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TommySama
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My mice never disapprove of me. They love me unconditionally. A useful personality quirk for the pets of a semi-narcissist with goals of achieving full on sociopathy by 2012! It's a bargain, All! Morals! Must! Go!!!!!!
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Omega M.
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I don't have any rabbits; I just think the ones on that site are cute. Here's what the creators say about the origin of their site:
quote:
It started years ago when Sharon and Bill Stiteler owned their first rabbit, a dwarf hotot mix named Latte. Tiny and cute as he was, he would hunker up in the bedroom and stare at them like a little Winston Churchill. He just always looked like he didn't approve... of anything.

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scifibum
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I failed at parenting today.

This seems like an un-resolvable dilemma:

1. Need to get in the car and go somewhere, now.
2. Kid is throwing a huge fit and won't stay in the car.
3. Giving in to what the kid wants will just assure future huge fits.

If not for the "now" part I can handle this kind of situation with gentle force & time outs (Just pick the kid up and carry him to his time out location and keep him there until he calms down and agrees to cooperate).

If not for #3 I can bribe or relent, and we get somewhere on time.

Today I thought I could try not relenting and still being on time. I got mad and it didn't accomplish anything.

This sort of thing is hugely demoralizing for me. Not being able to get the kid to submit to my will, and recognizing that needed/expecting that to be possible represents deep flaws in my parenting. Not being able to articulate what it is that I should be doing instead: being clueless. I need to civilize this kid somehow.

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Clark
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I apparently stink when it comes to searching the archives of this site, so I'll ask the rest of you for help.

I'm looking for a thread in which we were discussing LDS baptisms for the dead being performed for deceased Jews. As I remember it, someone (I think it was Ricky) made a couple of excellent statements explaining the reasons that Jews react so negatively to something that LDS feel that Jews ought to see as a meaningless ceremony. I believe it had to to with a belief that invoking their name could have an effect on their soul regardless of whether the LDS baptism ceremony is of any actual merit in the eyes of God. I believe this discussion came from one of the most recent times we've been over this topic, but I can't seem to find it.

If anyone with greater searching skills than I can help me out, I'd appreciate it.

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scifibum
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I think this is it
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RickyB
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The association with another religion's rituals is anathema. It renders you unclean. A religiously educated Jew will get a flash of revulsion at the idea of entering a church, much less participating in a service, and definitely being personally the subject of the service. An educated person, and or someone who has to, say, deal with inter-faith contacts, gets over it. But it's like a weaker version of the indoctrinated aversion to forbidden food. taboo, nu.

Again, all depending on what school of thought you're from. But for any religious Jew, it ranges from just pique without actual belief in metaphysical consequences, to belief indeed in such consequences.

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KnightEnder
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How old is the kid?
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scifibum
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5
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Clark
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Yes, that was exactly the thread I was looking for. Thanks. (I suppose I'll add that the exact statements I was remembering were from both Ricky and Everard.)
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Brian
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Seriously, RickyB (or Hannibal, or any Israeli Lurkers):

Is Emanuel a common name in Jewish culture?

Wasn't one of Jesus' titles the 'Emanuel'? Or is that kind of like the difference between being A man and being THE man?

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RickyB
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No, it wasn't. The Jesus-Emmanuel connection is Isaiah's snippet: "Lo, the maiden has conceived and bears a son, and thou shalt call his name Emmanuel".

It's a not very common but not at all unheard-of first name. As last name... Again, not Cohen, Levi, or anything remotely like that, but it exists.

There's a leading TV anchor named Emmanuel Rosen, and the coach who led Israel to its only world cup in 1970 is Emmanuel Shefer, and the foremost living translator of science fiction and fantasy in Israel, whose translation of "Dune" is better than the original, is Emmanuel Lottem. I can't think of any famous last-name Emmanuels at the moment.

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Brian
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So why didn't they 'call his name Emmanuel'? Why did they call him Jesus instead?
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Funean
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Presumably you're bigger than the kid, scifi. Power through!

(which is to say, pick his/her little butt up, stick it in the car, turn the stereo up REAL loud, and proceed.)

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scifibum
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Pretty much what I tried, Fun, but he wouldn't stay stuck, and I tried escalating through volume of voice (I am glad to say that I didn't shout anything particularly hurtful, I was just being loud which I'm not glad of), and it just got ugly. He's big enough to make forcing him to stay in the car impractical. [Frown] I suppose we could look for extra-large 5 point harness car seats that have child resistant release buttons. Sigh.

What I pine for is me asking him to do something, and it happening. I'll just have to keep working on it. In the meantime I need to be more careful about touching off a willpower deathmatch when i'm pressed for time.

Edit: I guess I didn't explain it very well but I was upset at myself for losing my temper to the point of real shouting, and despondent at the feeling of total powerlessness which I feel arises from my failure to teach my kid properly. While I was in the moment and losing my temper, I guess I thought (to the extent that I was thinking at all: not much) maybe if he knew I was really serious he would quit diving for the door every time I moved to shut it, and quit making it impossible to buckle the other kids in because he was scrambling to get out.

However, I COULD have gotten the other kids in, then inserted him through the front door and toward the back, and simply started driving while reminding him to get his seat belt on. In 5 or 10 minutes he probably would have sat down, and that would have been preferable to me yelling like an impotent *******. So, the advice is well taken, Fun.

And it has given me occasion to think about why there was a fight, and how to avoid the same thing in the future, so if I didn't scar my kids too badly today then I'll just maybe learn to do this right eventually.

[ November 11, 2008, 08:41 PM: Message edited by: scifibum ]

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Funean
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Oh, scifibum, you certainly have to stop worrying about scarring your kids. I mean, you're going to. It's your job, man! Do you want to leave that to someone else?! [Big Grin]

I hope I didn't sound like I was saying "now, scifi, you have to show 'im who's boss!" These little power struggles are distressing, not least because OF COURSE we can always win. It just feels like "at what cost?" I've come to conclude that there is no real cost to putting a stop to stuff like that. Generally, I think when they push the limits like this, they're really just trying to figure out how big the safe room is. While they truly might not want to do whatever it is, it's also true that finding out that you're still in charge of their (increasingly large and scary) world is comforting in the end.

On the practical level, a five year old is getting a bit old for time-outs (used properly, time outs are a safe place for cooling off, and so that mom/dad doesn't kill the toddler). He's probably ready for consequences. What has worked with my kids is:

1. explain that "no" isn't an option *right now* and you'll be glad to talk about what's making him so unhappy about having to do this once you're underway.
2. give him to a count of 3 or 5 to comply, explaining that there will be consequence X (early bedtime, no TV tonight, whatever is fairly immediate and something the kid won't want), and he'll STILL be going.
3. stuff him in the car and sit on him till he calms down enough to belt in.
4. begin dramatic distractathon--put on some music and sing loud, stupid Al Yankovic type variations on the lyrics, as stupid and gross as possible. Allow child to regroup and don't mention the defeat.
5. proceed with activity as planned.

By the way, I don't think it's a bad thing for kids to see their parents get angry, as long as you're not *scary*. It's important that they know what they do matters to you, you know? And it's not like you were screaming at an infant for crying, or personally deriding him. Don't be so hard on yourself.

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scifibum
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That sounds very r-
er..
rational.

(See what I did there? [Wink] )

Thanks. [Smile]

[ November 11, 2008, 10:01 PM: Message edited by: scifibum ]

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Funean
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That's the nicest thing anyone's done for me all day! [Smile]
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Haggis
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Anyone know of kenmeer's whereabouts? I just realized he hasn't posted since Halloween. Should I worry?
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munga
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Was he refraining from Ornery in a sign of solidarity with Tommysama, who was temporarily banned?

Did he come back with Tommy?

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munga
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scifi,

I had one escape-artist. It got to the point that I determined to take extra drives so that I could watch him slip out, stop the car, and pull over to pull him completely out and whack him. Eventually, it got to be so dispiriting (he was climbing out because he wanted to cruise around in the car for the ride, rather than be restrained, and if the car-ride turned into a car-stop with whacking it wasn't what he was wanting anyway). I told him (he was too young to be told anything more sophisticated) that the car stops when people are out of their belts.

I know, it was a sorta-lie. I STOP the car, when people out of belts, but I said it plainly enough.

I do have a memory of one particular whacking when I pulled over, pulled him out, whacked him on the butt, yelling "CAR SEAT" and then I saw there was a policeman in a car right at the corner, watching and listening to me, but he didn't do thing about my corporal punishment. I was loud and mad but not scary.

[ November 11, 2008, 11:00 PM: Message edited by: munga ]

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munga
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By the way, that lasted about a week.

By age five, if I get into a car with the kids and start it, and find that one block down the road they still haven't belted up, I stop the car and pull out and give em a whack on the butt, not because I had told them (which I hadn't) to get belted, but because they are in a car and know the rules, period. It's their job to get the belt on, or to ask for help before the car moves.

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munga
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I haven't had to do any of that in a loonnnnnnnng time. My youngest is six now, and he wasn't the escape artist (that was my 11 year old) and all the kids know the rules, now.
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munga
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Haggis,

KL just posted on the immigration thread. He's not lost, just avoiding you!

[Razz]

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munga
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I miss TSG.
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TommySama
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Shut up! Don't say his name! Lest he crawl back out of that Latin American hellhole and cover us in frivolous posts that even I feel dirty saying inappropriate things in.
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munga
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he was like a pit bull- incapable of letting go.

great, if he's on your side.

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RickyB
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"great, if he's on your side."

Not really. He mostly made arguments which did not serve the side all that well. Being a very prodigious poster, he also made a fair amount of good ones, and occasionally a really good one, but the scales tip markedly.

He was improving steadily, though.

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NobleHunter
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It figures that I finally stop lurking when most everybody's asleep.

I guess I'm a nocturnal poster.

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RickyB
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[Smile]

It's noon here, so I'm up.

[ November 12, 2008, 05:13 AM: Message edited by: RickyB ]

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NobleHunter
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I figured as much. Maybe I'm not nocturnal, just time shifted. I'm an extra in a cable package?

But I'm almost done the work I have to do and sleep beckons. My spree comes to an end, I think.

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scifibum
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quote:
Originally posted by munga:

I do have a memory of one particular whacking when I pulled over, pulled him out, whacked him on the butt, yelling "CAR SEAT" and then I saw there was a policeman in a car right at the corner, watching and listening to me, but he didn't do thing about my corporal punishment. I was loud and mad but not scary.

That's pretty funny. [Smile]
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RickyB
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"So why didn't they 'call his name Emmanuel'? Why did they call him Jesus instead? "

Um, because he was force-fit to the prophecy post facto? Conversely, someone forgot to deliver the memo from dad to mom in the barn? [Smile] Emmanuel means "god is with us", with a shade of "with=among us" which is probably how many of my homie J-dawg's followers felt about him.

And by the way, what they in fact called him was Yeshua. You westerners with your Greek made it Yezus, and then Gee-zus and so on... [Smile]

[ November 12, 2008, 10:58 AM: Message edited by: RickyB ]

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Brian
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I think I mentioned in the other thread that I don't speak Yiddish? [Razz]

But my question was mostly answered by the post-facto point.
It just seemed to me that 'Emmanuel' was slapped on as sort of a title, and that Jews would shy away from naming anyone else that. But I guess if Germans still name their kids Adolf (although more rarely) after only 50 years, that some of the association with Emmanuel might have faded after a few paltry centuries.

[ November 12, 2008, 11:35 AM: Message edited by: Brian ]

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yossarian22c
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Does anyone know what percentage of incumbents in the house of representatives won their reelection bids? I'm just curious with the congressional approval rating below 20% how many of the reps we sent back.
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IrishTD
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According to wikipedia, there will be 52 new HoR members in the 111th Congress (Jan 2009-2011). Not sure how many of those new ones were due to the previous member retiring though...
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RickyB
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We'd have to give up major portions of the OT if we banned parts every time some Christian went on about "See, see???? This PROVESSSSSSSSS that Jesus was the Messaiah". [Razz]

[ November 12, 2008, 03:30 PM: Message edited by: RickyB ]

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IrishTD
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This wikipedia link shows 4 HoR incumbents losing primary and 17 more losing in the general election (with two too close to call). Page also mentions 32 retirements (but at least one of those didn't occur since Duncan Hunter was reelected).
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Pete at Home
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quote:
Originally posted by RickyB:
We'd have to give up major portions of the OT if we banned parts every time some Christian went on about "See, see???? This PROVESSSSSSSSS that Jesus was the Messaiah". [Razz]

Don't laugh too much. You gave up stained glass windows in your synagogues and a considerable portion of your hymns in order to not look like the Christians. But I'm glad that the Tenach wasn't banned.
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RickyB
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"You gave up stained glass windows in your synagogues and a considerable portion of your hymns in order to not look like the Christians."

Not in any synagogue I ever visited. Whatchu talkin' about? Ever hear of Mark Chagall?
http://jerusalemgreatsynagogue.com/TEST/windows.htm

[ November 13, 2008, 09:35 AM: Message edited by: RickyB ]

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