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Author Topic: Latest South Park show about censorship is censored
JWatts
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'Muhammad' now a dirty word on 'South Park'

quote:
After last week's episode of the Comedy Central series sparked a threat (and yes, it was certainly a threat) from a radical Islamic website, the network has cracked-down-for-their-own-good on creators Trey Parker and Matt Stone during last night's continuation of the show's storyline.

For those who missed the drama, the show's 200th episode last week mocked the one "celebrity" that the series has been largely unable to depict, the Prophet Muhammad, who was hidden from view in a bear costume. A U.S.-based website RevolutionMuslim.com then warned Parker and Stone they could end up like Theo Van Gogh (the Dutch filmmaker who was murdered by Muslim extremists after depicting Muhammad on his show) and even posted the address of the show's production office. The site has since been shut down.

Last night, "South Park" continued the controversial Muhammad storyline, but with a key difference: every instance of the words "Prophet Muhammad" was bleeped out, making the episode practically incomprehensible, especially to anybody who missed the previous week.

Chalk up another win for Muslim intimidation. Comedy Central apparently has caved to the threat and actually censored the show which was, ironically, about poking fun at Muslim censorship.

quote:

Parker and Stone comment on "South Park" censorship:
In the 14 years we've been doing South Park we have never done a show that we couldn't stand behind. We delivered our version of the show to Comedy Central and they made a determination to alter the episode. It wasn't some meta-joke on our part. Comedy Central added the bleeps. In fact, Kyle's customary final speech was about intimidation and fear. It didn't mention Muhammad at all but it got bleeped too. We'll be back next week with a whole new show about something completely different and we'll see what happens to it.


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scifibum
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I'm fairly disgusted with the general situation. I think the best way to make sure that Muslim extremists will murder people for sacrilege is to cower when they threaten to do it. If such threats were obviously (universally) counterproductive, I think we'd all be better off.
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TomDavidson
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quote:
For those who missed the drama, the show's 200th episode last week mocked the one "celebrity" that the series has been largely unable to depict, the Prophet Muhammad, who was hidden from view in a bear costume.
They've actually done a couple eps with Muhammed in 'em; the bear costume is a new gag, but they've tread this ground before.
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JoshCrow
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Muslims are not some sort of special exempt group - they can be made fun of like all the rest of us. I am disturbed by Comedy Central's reaction, and will consider this a serious strike against them.
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Pete at Home
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Glad to hear that there's one set of American entertainers with the guts to take this on.
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G2
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quote:
Originally posted by JoshCrow:
Muslims are not some sort of special exempt group - they can be made fun of like all the rest of us. I am disturbed by Comedy Central's reaction, and will consider this a serious strike against them.

Ask a couple of Danish cartoonists if Muslims should be ridiculed like the other religions. G2 doesn't think you can just say "they can be made fun of like all the rest of us" because all the rest of us don't kill the people making fun of us.

Don't be disappointed with the dhimmitude of Comedy Central, be disappointed with Islam.

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JoshCrow
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quote:
Originally posted by G2:
Ask a couple of Danish cartoonists if Muslims should be ridiculed like the other religions. G2 doesn't think you can just say "they can be made fun of like all the rest of us" because all the rest of us don't kill the people making fun of us.

Don't be disappointed with the dhimmitude of Comedy Central, be disappointed with Islam.

My disappointment with a great majority of religions is already clear, but being upset with Comedy Central is new to me.

Let the extremists of the muslim world work themselves up into a frenzy over another cartoon. It's not as though they wouldn't find any excuse they can. If they don't like it, balls to them. They should be asking themselves why their religion is becoming a pariah instead of looking at a TV show that lampoons everyone and everything.

[ April 23, 2010, 10:29 AM: Message edited by: JoshCrow ]

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cherrypoptart
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I'm absolutely certain that these extremists are misinterpreting their religion because there is no way it could call for this type of violence against people just trying to make us laugh and think.
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JWatts
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quote:
Originally posted by cherrypoptart:
I'm absolutely certain that these extremists are misinterpreting their religion because there is no way it could call for this type of violence against people just trying to make us laugh and think.

I'm not an expert on the Koran, but from what I've heard (second hand) you are wrong. I'm pretty sure devout Muslims think that laughing about Muhammad is cause for violence.

I'm also don't think that violence used to defend Islam is considered a fringe view in Muslim communities. If you've got stats that say otherwise, I'd love to see them.

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TomDavidson
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Cherry was being sarcastic.
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cherrypoptart
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You caught me Tom. [Smile]

Yes, it's going to be very difficult for the defenders of and apoligists for Islam to explain this one away.

I've said all along that Islam is a violent, intolerant religion and that the Islamic radicals are the peaceful Muslims who reject what the Koran really says in favor of a more tolerant, peaceful existence.

Whether that is biding for time or their true feelings in one way doesn't matter, because they become irrelevant as they are murdered just like the rest of us infidels.

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Pete at Home
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Wonder if you could screen out sleepers and extremists from immigration by hooking them to a polygraph and showing them various cartoons.
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JoshCrow
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quote:
Originally posted by cherrypoptart:

I've said all along that Islam is a violent, intolerant religion and that the Islamic radicals are the peaceful Muslims who reject what the Koran really says in favor of a more tolerant, peaceful existence.

Tolerance is anathema to most religions as they were written, because they were designed to propagate themselves, not dilute into vapidity. I agree with you that the actual "radicals" are watering down their texts to be socially acceptable by today's standards - but I think this applies just as well to most modern religions.

Islam, however, just happens to have the greatest cross-section of uneducated believers who don't just use the text as an excuse to suit their ACTUAL beliefs (which come from other sources) - they take it at face value.

[ April 23, 2010, 03:44 PM: Message edited by: JoshCrow ]

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JWatts
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quote:
Originally posted by cherrypoptart:
You caught me Tom. [Smile]

Oops, I missed the sarcasm. [DOH]
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JWatts
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quote:

Danish cartoonist put on indefinite leave following attacks
COPENHAGEN - Danish cartoonist Kurt Westergaard, who has been attacked and repeatedly threatened over a drawing of Prophet Mohammed, has been placed on indefinite leave by his newspaper "for security reasons," he told AFP Thursday.

"It is forced vacation but it looks a lot like I'm being retired," the 75-year-old cartoonist said, adding that he himself still had an "insatiable desire" to work.

The Danish cartoonist sparked violent protests in the Muslim world with a drawing of Mohammed wearing a turban shaped like a bomb, published along with 11 other cartoons of the Prophet in the Jyllands-Posten daily newspaper in September 2005.

He has received numerous death threats and on January 1 this year, a 28-year-old Somali man broke into his home near the northwestern city of Aarhus and attempted to kill him with an axe and a knife.

Westergaard, who survived by hiding in a panic room, said Thursday he would likely "reluctantly" accept retirement, but that he planned to meet the newspaper's chief editor on June 1 "to discuss the future."

Jyllands-Posten often allows people over the official retirement age of 67 to continue working, he said, adding however that the paper, in his opinion, wanted him to leave "for security reasons."

"It's a pity. I have become a too heavy burden and a very big security risk," he said, adding that he had not actually worked for the paper since last November.

"The management was worried following the arrests last year of two men in Chicago who planned to attack Jyllands-Posten, and after the attack on me in January," he explained.

Source
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RickyB
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"Wonder if you could screen out sleepers and extremists from immigration by hooking them to a polygraph and showing them various cartoons."

The Dutch have a system that, while not involving a polygraph, makes applicants sign off on being cool with various things (like gays and free speech). I guess you could have a system where applicants for entry are shown stuff and their reactions observed.

I totally agree that this is a crying shame and a disgrace on the part of CC. Fock Muhammad.

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Pyrtolin
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http://littlegreenfootballs.com/article/36230_Jon_Stewarts_Advice_to_Those_Who_Threaten_Death_in_the_Name_of_Religion

The Daily Show is brilliant on the subject.

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RickyB
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I recommend the following suffix for Muhammad: PBUH (short for Pox Be Upon Him... Works for Jesus/Paul, Moses, Buddha and Vishnu as well...) [Razz]
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Pete at Home
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How long until other groups get the message that if you don't like being mocked, you just need to kill a few people?
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Sauurman
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Honestly entertainers, cartoonists and newspapers need to just all get together and make fun of their retarded pedo prophet. What are the terrorists going to do, kill everyone?

Honestly the more violent and the more pissed off they react the more blatant, offensive and cruder the mockery should be.

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Pete at Home
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I don't think that's a good idea, Sauurman. What you suggest would hurt the moderate muslims as well, like the guy in the John Stewart video linked above.

Didn't see the Ep but sounds like South Park wasn't making fun of Mohamed but rather of those that kill because of any use of his image, hence the bear costume.

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cherrypoptart
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It's kind of funny that it takes a cartoon to finally get liberals to see the truth. Should have thought of that earlier.

I do like Sauurman's idea, and if it hurts moderate muslims as well, that serves to give the lie to the term moderate muslim. When push comes to shove, we'll see how moderate they really are if they think that everyone in the world must bow down to them and their religion and have our behavior and what we say, watch and listen to dictated by them. It's better to find out now than at crunch time.

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TomDavidson
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quote:
I do like Sauurman's idea, and if it hurts moderate muslims as well, that serves to give the lie to the term moderate muslim.
Why?
That's be like saying that, to punish the ultra-orthodox Jew, we should ban all kosher food in this country -- and if it hurts moderate Jews, it just goes to prove there aren't any.

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cherrypoptart
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I think it'd be more like someone threatening to kill people if they eat kosher food so in response, we all eat some kosher food and tell them to bring it on. Like some Christians who don't like the idea of anyone having gay sex and would have it outlawed and anyone engaging in it improsoned. At some point, you have to stand up and say that even though you know others don't like it, it's your life and your freedom and you're not going to give it up because of their religion.

If there really are moderates, they'll be able to take a joke. If this makes wish death upon someone, they need to rethink their definition of moderation.

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TomDavidson
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quote:
If there really are moderates, they'll be able to take a joke.
I don't think this logically follows. They may not wind up "wishing death" upon you, depending on how "moderate" they are, but I think they'd certainly be within their rights to feel horribly insulted.
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Sauurman
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And how often are other religions mocked? It hurts moderate muslims... oh noes.

South Park made this point so amazingly well. I really liked the part where they are talking to the Super Friends. There you have Buddah doing coke and Jesus watching internet porn. That is OK but offending muslims isn't? Bull.

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Pete at Home
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quote:
Originally posted by Sauurman:
And how often are other religions mocked?

Too often, and often wrongfully. Often with sadism and malice, and without any reasonable justification.
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Pete at Home
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quote:
Originally posted by Sauurman:
There you have Buddah doing coke and Jesus watching internet porn. That is OK but offending muslims isn't?

Who said that's OK? Sounds pretty stupid to me.

There's a lot of value in South Park, and utility even in some of the offensive mocking stuff, but what you describes sounds simply stupid, useless, masturbatory. Like Flynt's droolingly moronic ad featuring Falwell.

And absolutely constitutionally protected. As the Flynt case showed, there's a fundamental constitutional right to bad taste. That mean they can air it, and I can say that the world would be better off without it. But the world would be a worse place if the government forbid such things.

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TommySama
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quote:
There's a lot of value in South Park, and utility even in some of the offensive mocking stuff, but what you describes sounds simply stupid, useless, masturbatory. Like Flynt's droolingly moronic ad featuring Falwell.
It obviously was not useless considering that we got a ground breaking supreme court decision out of Flynt's ad. South Park's portrayal of Jesus, Buddha, the Mormons, the Scientologists, Noah, and (hopefully someday) of Muhammad helps draw these things back into the real world so they can be criticized - or mocked and defiled - like anything else.
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cherrypoptart
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Seattle cartoonist launches "Everybody Draw Mohammed Day"

http://www.mynorthwest.com/?nid=11&sid=313170

By JAMIE GRISWOLD
MyNorthwest.com

After Comedy Central cut a portion of a South Park episode following a death threat from a radical Muslim group, Seattle cartoonist Molly Norris wanted to counter the fear. She has declared May 20th "Everybody Draw Mohammed Day."

"As a cartoonist I just felt so much passion about what had happened I wanted to kind of counter Comedy Central's message they sent about feeling afraid," Norris said.

Norris has asked other artists to submit drawings of any religious figure to be posted as part of Citizens Against Citizens Against Humor (CACAH) on May 20th.

On her website Norris explains this is not meant to disrespect any religion, but rather meant to protect people's right to express themselves.

----------------------------------------------

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Pete at Home
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quote:
Originally posted by TommySama:
quote:
There's a lot of value in South Park, and utility even in some of the offensive mocking stuff, but what you describes sounds simply stupid, useless, masturbatory. Like Flynt's droolingly moronic ad featuring Falwell.
It obviously was not useless considering that we got a ground breaking supreme court decision out of Flynt's ad.
By that logic, there must be some intrinsic value in the KKK and Neonazi hate marches, since they also resulted in ground breaking supreme court decisions.

Note that from what I've seen, I *do* concede some degree of social value in South Park's mockery of moromons, even the parts I find extremely offensive.

What I'm saying here is that based on caselaw, the three concepts of social value, offensiveness, and absolute mandate to protect under the first amendment, are NOT co-terminous. IF you seriously want to argue for a concept where first amendment protection implies social value, then you might consider peddling yourself as PR spokesman for the neonazis and the Westboro Baptist church.

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Pete at Home
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In fact, if you pretend to construe implicit value in Flynt's publication, then you've undermined and diminished the scope and protections of that Supreme Court decision.
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Pete at Home
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The bear costume stuff was also clever and useful, while no doubt offensive to some. What I said was useless constitutionally protected bad taste was this: "There you have Buddah doing coke and Jesus watching internet porn."
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TommySama
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quote:
In fact, if you pretend to construe implicit value in Flynt's publication, then you've undermined and diminished the scope and protections of that Supreme Court decision.
Its late, so I might have to rewrite this tomorrow, but the value is in class sentiments. Moral treatises and meta philosophical analysis is not accessible to the vast majority of human beings. Flynt's magazine/ads were important because they were so outside the norm that they got attention and constitutional protection while at the same time acting as a sort of political critique of the upper and middle classes, the religious, the educated (etc).
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cherrypoptart
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Somalia Radicals Declare Music 'Un-Islamic'

Last week, the Somalian fundamentalist Islamic group Hizbul Islam announced that music of any kind is "un-Islamic," warning of "serious consequences" for those who dare to violate their decree. In response, radio stations all over the country, including those run by the moderate Muslim transitional government, cut all music from their broadcasts. Even intro music for news reports was scrapped. In its place? "We are using sounds such as gunfire, the noise of vehicles and the sound of birds to link up our programmes and news," said one Somalian head of radio programming.

The music decree follows a string of fundamentalist decrees, including prohibitions on wearing bras (also "un-Islamic"), the banning of modern movies and news channels, including the BBC and Voice of America.

As evidence of a power struggle between the moderate Muslim government and the hard-line radicals who control many parts of the country, Sheik Ahmed's government responded last Sunday by saying any radio stations that stopped playing music would face closure. In the government's eyes, those radio stations that complied with the ban were colluding with the radicals.

In the meantime, the radio stations have been caught between a rock and a hard place. "The order and counter-order are very destructive," radio director Abukar Hassan Kadaf said in the Times article. "Each group are issuing orders against us and we are the victims."

In the escalating tug-of-war between Western and Islamic powers over freedom of expression, what remains to be seen is how much of a causal relationship exists between the two. Is a proposed burqa ban in Quebec a result of the shuttering of a radio station in Somalia? Does a call for prohibition of headscarves in Paris force a bra-burning in Mogadishu?

If Islamic decrees do, in fact, fuel the fire for legal actions in the West (and vice versa), then continued and increased prohibition seems inevitable. But if radical Islam and a skeptical West are destined to one-up each other in a battle of bans, the powers that be might remember the men and women caught in the crossfire. That is, the women in the West who wear niqabs by choice, or the men and women in Somalia who just want to listen to music. What is perhaps most strikingly absent in all the brouhaha surrounding sharia vs. Western law are the voices of the moderate Muslims themselves. In the end, perhaps the gulf between the two sides will prove too great to be bridged, but for the immediate future, we would do well to remember the ground we share in common. Before there's nothing left to ban.

Alex Wagner

-------------------------------------------

Now with music bans? Even smooth jazz? Even classical? What's peaceful about that?

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Pete at Home
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quote:
Originally posted by TommySama:
quote:
In fact, if you pretend to construe implicit value in Flynt's publication, then you've undermined and diminished the scope and protections of that Supreme Court decision.
Its late, so I might have to rewrite this tomorrow, but the value is in class sentiments. Moral treatises and meta philosophical analysis is not accessible to the vast majority of human beings. Flynt's magazine/ads were important because they were so outside the norm that they got attention and constitutional protection while at the same time acting as a sort of political critique of the upper and middle classes, the religious, the educated (etc).
I'm not a reader nor interested in becoming one, so I can't argue with you whether there's some value in Flynt's publication generally. But that is completely irrelevant to the issue at stake in Flynt v. Falwell, which was one single ad. I am familiar with the ad in question, and quite willing to discuss with you any particular parts that you believe have value.

Now if I were to imitate the content of ad, and write a mock-first person account of you supposedly having sex with your mom (as Flynt did to Falwell in the ad in question) I think we could all agree that the statement was without value. Except perhaps as an analogy, which wasn't present in the original context of the ad.

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Gaoics79
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quote:
Why?
That's be like saying that, to punish the ultra-orthodox Jew, we should ban all kosher food in this country -- and if it hurts moderate Jews, it just goes to prove there aren't any.

There's no "hurt" at all in this case. No one is telling them what to eat, or how to practice their religion.

If someone feels hurt, then **** them. I don't give two craps about their "offence". So-called "moderates" who call for banning of blasphemy are not moderates at all. In some ways they're more dangerous than the "extremists" because they pretend to be something they're not.

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Michelle
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Just curious -- but what do extremists use to symbolize their roles in lives? I mean, it's all well and good to say life in the hereafter will be wondrous, (lots of virgin oil and stuff) but you still need symbols to represent the aspect of life itself.
For instance, samurai warriors, and kamikaze pilots connected to cherry blossoms for they represented a brief, but well-lived life.

Do Muslim extremists have symbols to represent their lives?

[ April 26, 2010, 08:54 PM: Message edited by: Michelle ]

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G2
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quote:
Originally posted by cherrypoptart:
Seattle cartoonist launches "Everybody Draw Mohammed Day"

http://www.mynorthwest.com/?nid=11&sid=313170

By JAMIE GRISWOLD
MyNorthwest.com

After Comedy Central cut a portion of a South Park episode following a death threat from a radical Muslim group, Seattle cartoonist Molly Norris wanted to counter the fear. She has declared May 20th "Everybody Draw Mohammed Day."

Seattle cartoonists chickens out:
quote:
In declaring May 20th to be “Everybody Draw Muhammad Day,” Seattle artist Molly Norris created a poster-like cartoon showing many objects — from a cup of coffee to a box of pasta to a tomato — all claiming to be the likeness of Muhammad.

[...]On Friday, Norris told a radio talk show host in Seattle that she came up with the idea because “as a cartoonist, I just felt so much passion about what had happened…” noting that “it’s a cartoonist’s job to be non-PC.”

That passion, it appears, has lessened. And fast.

Her stark website today reads: “”I am NOT involved in “Everybody Draw Mohammd [sic] Day!”

[...]

Once it became a national story she reeled back, asking [blogger Dan] Savage — in an email he provided to The Ticket — if he would “be kind enough to switch out my poster” with another one — a much tamer version which has no images attributed to Muhammad.

“I am sort of freaked out about my name/image being all over the place,” her e-mail reads.

Someone must have mentioned to her how muslims kill people that do that.
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TommySama
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Killed one person, right? Anyways, they are fighting a losing battle
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