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Author Topic: Stupid Is As Stupid Does
Daruma28
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For an alternative point of view...

By Robert L. Johnson.

A recent ABC News/Washington Post poll shows that 51 percent of the voting cattle are upset with Obama and the Democrats. Their solution is to replace the Democrats with Republicans! This is similar to actual beef cattle preferring Burger King to McDonalds. Either way, the cattle lose.

The Republicans, who the voting cattle are taking a shine to, send the children of the voters through the meat-grinders in Iraq and Afghanistan just as the Democrats do. The principle is no different than both parties sending them in years past through the meat-grinders of WWI, WWII, Korea and Vietnam. Both parties put America’s resources, including her children, at the disposal of Israel, both parties are trying to get a war started with Iran for Israel’s benefit, both parties keep the same gang of thieves in control of American currency, neither party helps the people to find employment. In short, both parties are full of liars and con-artists. Voting for either of these political machines is an exercise in “stupid is as stupid does,” which allows us to view those who vote as stupid based on the foolish/stupid act they commit which in this case is voting.

Albert Einstein once defined insanity as, “doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.” By Einstein’s definition, it is very clear that voting falls squarely within Einstein’s definition of insanity. Every two or four years the politicians from both parties determine what the voting cattle want to hear and they tell it to them. The voters actually believe what they’re being told each and every time and do their duty to the national scam and cast their vote for their favorite liar. Then, after an appropriate amount of time passes, the voters realize they’ve been fooled by the politicians and get “mad as Hell” and vow to “vote the bums out of office” in the next election. A major problem with this is there are only other bums to replace the first set of bums with! However, since voting is much easier and safer than revolution, the sheeple are happy to perform their patriotic duty. They are so sold on the scam of replacing one group of charlatans with another group of charlatans, they tell people who are smart enough not to fall for the voting scam that they/we can’t complain about what the elected politicians do or don’t do since we did not vote. The fact that voting for one crook over another only reinforces evil and gives more life to the scam, the politically insane cannot grasp.

The article about the ABC News/Washington Post poll says, “Registered voters by 62-26 percent are inclined to look around for someone new for Congress rather than to re-elect their current representative.” It appears their insanity has blinded them to the fact that there is absolutely nothing new in either political party. This consistency in the commonality of corruption found deep in both parties is a primary reason America is consistently sinking. Voting only accelerates the decline in happiness and the quality of life as well as the continued erosion of our rights and liberties. By keeping their heads buried deep in the scams of politics as usual, the voters cannot possibly see the bold words of instruction written in the Declaration of Independence. The instruction reads, “whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends,” (life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness of the individual) “it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it,” which puts much more responsibility and risk on the individual than merely continuing the voting game/scam.

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TommySama
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There are other options available (assuming you don't want to be gunned down by the police or otherwise pulverized by the military).

[ July 22, 2010, 12:20 AM: Message edited by: TommySama ]

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Pete at Home
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Daruma, we might all agree on not liking the status quo, but try to get us to agree on what we do want, and at the very best we might end up with something that looks a lot like the status quo. More likely we'd end up with something that looked more like our last civil war -- not even counting the damage of the initial conflict with the feds. The civil war part would only be the argument between the victors of the first conflict.
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Rallan
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quote:
Originally posted by Daruma28:

Albert Einstein once defined insanity as, “doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.”

This seems like a remarkably concise summary of your attempts to convince us all that we're sheeple. All you ever do is hammer away with radical libertarian op-eds that make exactly the same points about the alleged conspiracy over and over again and hope that the ten thousandth thread you start will get a different result to the 9999 that went before it.
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Pete at Home
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Glad to see the Concord Party site is still up.
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Pyrtolin
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Another example for your list of kinds of authoritarians? "People cannot be trusted to govern themselves, so its our fundamental responsibility to put an end to this voting nonsense and use... ahem... other means to impose a better system on them."
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cherrypoptart
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As badly as the Republicans tax us, it's pretty clear now that they tax us less than the Democrats would like. That's got to count for something. The more money the government takes from you, the less freedom you have to do what you want, and the more power and control the government has over your life.

As much as there is the contention that there is no difference between the two parties, I think the past few months have shown us that there is a difference, a huge difference. In many cases it is a difference of scale to be sure, but it's a scale on which you could weigh a whale.

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TomDavidson
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Are "voting cattle" better or worse than "sheeple?" I don't really have a good grasp of the domesticated human hierarchy.

quote:
As badly as the Republicans tax us, it's pretty clear now that they tax us less than the Democrats would like.
Depending on your definition of "us," I disagree.
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Rallan
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quote:
Originally posted by cherrypoptart:
As badly as the Republicans tax us, it's pretty clear now that they tax us less than the Democrats would like. That's got to count for something. The more money the government takes from you, the less freedom you have to do what you want, and the more power and control the government has over your life.

Not necessarily better. The previous administration pioneered the exciting new world of "Taxcut and Spend" budgets.
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Al Wessex
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Cherry, they also are more inclined toward letting industries and commercial sectors do what they want with as little oversight as possible. That's because of a mistaken belief that a free and open marketplace has a shred of morality.

BTW, Daruma, repetition leads to being tuned out, so....what was it you were saying? Make it more interesting by putting specific proposals up for discussion. I'll start for you with a list of Libertarian ideas that are already on the table:

. Privatize the highway system to give people more options for how to travel long distances by car.

. Create a more diverse business and cultural environment by reaffirming people's right to discriminate on the basis of race, ethnicity or religion.

. Encourage people to learn more about the world through their own direct experience rather than from books written by bureaucrats by eliminating the public school system.

. Encourage people to learn about and understand how their bodies work at a more deep and satisfying level and save money for medical emergencies by eliminating taxes that go to Medicare, Medical and NIH immediately.

. Encourage the strengthening of family ties by phasing out Social Security over the next 12-24 months. Eliminate the taxes now.

. Start a cement company to supply the enclave-construction business, or start a nation-wide assault weapon retail business targeted for the home protection market.

[ July 22, 2010, 08:16 AM: Message edited by: Al Wessex ]

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Gaoics79
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Daruma, specifically, what would you propose be done in this case to rectify the situation?
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JWatts
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quote:
Originally posted by Rallan:
Not necessarily better. The previous administration pioneered the exciting new world of "Taxcut and Spend" budgets.

"Taxcut and Spend" was pretty short sided and stupid. The tax cuts were marginally useful before 9/11, but taxes should have been increased as soon as the costs of the additional security measures and wars kicked in.

However, the "Tax and Spend Much More" is a worse philosophy. The Federal spending in the last two years is completely out of control and ever the upcoming tax increases aren't going to come close to balancing the budget.

When the SS and Medicare deficits truly kick into high gear over the next decade, the Federal budget will start resembling the California model.

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Pyrtolin
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Which is very strongly why we need to take advantage of low rates right now and go for Invest and Profit to help close the gap, rather than making it worse by shorting our investments that create the best future revenue.
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Wayward Son
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While people want change, Daruma, they mostly want change for the better.

Sure, voting for one party or the other may not change things significantly. But they won't make things significantly worse, either.

Revolution always sounds good, until you count the bodies. That, by definition, is worse than a status quo where people are not dying in the streets.

And there is no guarantee that, once the revolution is over, the new guys aren't just another set of the same old bums you had before. [Frown]

Or worse! [Eek!]

People aren't cattle or sheeple. They do what they guess is best under the circumstances. Radical change can make things radically better, but often times makes things radically worse. Cautious change is best; it hurts the fewest people. But it isn't dramatic, and rarely satisfying.

But it has fewer regrets.

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G2
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quote:
Originally posted by TommySama:
There are other options available (assuming you don't want to be gunned down by the police or otherwise pulverized by the military).

There really aren't. Take the House of Representative, how many of the district represented there are considered "safe" by either the Republicans or Democrats? Only a very limited number of seats in the government are open to third parties. For example:
quote:
In the 2010 election, 331 of the 435 seats in the U.S. House of Representatives, 76 percent, are considered “safe” or gerrymandered for one party. That means the opposing party has zero chance to win that election due to artificially drawn electoral district boundaries that concentrate one party’s voters in a district.
Nobody is going to pry those safe districts out of Republican or Democrat hands. To even take a shot at the remaining seats in a contested area, you need access to millions of dollars (2008 elections rang in at a cost of $5.3 billion dollars for the House, $500 million for the Senate).

You may have a choice during primary battles for the "safe" districts between whichever candidate is running for the safe party's nomination. But in truly safe districts, like Pelosi's, you don't even have that.

The nomination in one of the rare non-safe districts is almost certainly going to the person that can raise enough money to buy it. It will very likely be an R or a D that can generate the necessary cash flow to purchase the nomination/seat. Third parties don't have that much money. Sure, there will be the occasional token "outsider" or the rare upset but that is far and away an exception.

What is the difference between R's and D's? Virtually nil. As the last 25 years show, they're both driving us to the same destination, they just argue about which road to take and the speed to drive.

If you think there is really any choice available in modern American politics, you are doing only wishful thinking.

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G2
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quote:
Originally posted by Wayward Son:
People aren't cattle or sheeple. They do what they guess is best under the circumstances

The problem is, they do not know the circumstances. With the abject failure of public education, MediaThink rules the America voter. People are led like cattle or sheeple through a coordinated media (seen Journolist?) and are fed only the circumstances deemed worthy or "right". No, it's not a conspiracy nor is it perfect but it is coordinated and it is effective with an uneducated and distracted electorate.

I agree, people are indeed doing what they think is best under the circumstances. They just don't, for the most part, get to know what the circumstances really are.

[ July 22, 2010, 11:56 AM: Message edited by: G2 ]

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Colin JM0397
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Funny how these topics always turn into a scripted left-right baaa-baaa-baaaaing within about 3 posts...
Funny if it wasn't so sad, of course.

What to do?
Revolution, but not in the way most of you think.

There are some non-affiliated candidates out there - find them and support them. The government we have today took many, many years to build up this way - it'll take many years for the people to take it back. But you have to start somewhere. If you want change, then you need to do it yourself. Otherwise, check out Twitter to see how Lindsey Lohan is doing in prison, check out which celibritard is on TV tonight, read the papers for a rundown of how good the financial reform bill is for us regular folks, and eat your CAFO-raised hormone-injected GMO-corn fed burger from McDonald's for dinner.

Ignorance is bliss. Most people don't want freedom; it scares them. They only want comfort.
Granted, the powers that be have done a fantastic job convincing people that's all they need to be happy.

I think a very small lot of us are self-sadists. We like the pain. Push ourselves into painful realms in order to make a gain – physically, emotionally, and/or spiritually. Those kinds of folks will embrace the hard freedom of responsibility. Most of the rest of society abhors pain and discomfort of any kind, so avoids it at all costs.

Yet, emotionally speaking (spiritually as well if you want to go there), we are a very unhappy culture. IMO because we know we’ve sold ourselves out for creature comforts.
The cognitive dissonance only goes so far. In those dark places we each go at night when alone, we know.

Our bodies are fat from lack of use, our brains are mushy from lack of intelligent stimulation, and our spirits are dim from lack of any soulful connection.

It's a tough one to fight against - I'm fighting for freedom and being uncomfortably healthy and informed against fat, happy, and comfortably apathetic.

So, basically, we’re screwed because fat, happy, and comfortably apathetic wins for most folks - even if it means lying to yourself that your life is meaningful and happy.

But who am I to say following a celibritard, watching mind-numbing TV, and eating crap isn’t the end-all-be-all for you to be happy? In that case, vote away for your favorite side of the machine.

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Al Wessex
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[Edit -- I misread you at first. I think you and I are largely in agreement. So ignore the first two sentences...]

Colin, your spirit is willing, at least. I think a different sort of change is needed. Rather than take back the government, people need to take back responsibility for their own situations. I don't mean that we should give up all entitlements as a wholesale gesture; I mean that we should all learn as much as we possibly can about the choices that we are faced with and do the intelligent and responsible thing wherever possible.

For instance, look at the labels on your food and don't eat/buy the ones that can hurt you. Don't eat at restaurants that can't prove their food is healthy. Better yet, grow some of your food or buy from people you know instead of from price-oriented chains. How do you know which choices are the better ones? Ask questions, talk to friends, ask experts, educate yourself.

If your Congressman wants to vote for higher/lower taxes or to introduce/eliminate a program, ask him/her why s/he takes that position. Educate yourself about the topic and ask intelligent questions. Don't take bullsh*t answers at face value.

If most of us (all is too much to wish for) did this in as many aspects of our lives as we could, we would indeed be taking back control of the country. No more charges that we are sheeple from people who really just want to be shepherds, no need for an angry revolution. In fact, we'd all be happier and healthier for it.

[ July 22, 2010, 12:39 PM: Message edited by: Al Wessex ]

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Colin JM0397
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Change starts at home.
A large problem with change, as with any big project, is people tend to look at the whole. In other words, they get frustrated by the bigness before ever trying.

A marathon looks ominous as all 24 miles at once. But running a marathon is nothing more than one step after another.

Start with the local and state offices, and maybe even your local Congress rep, but start somewhere.

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JWatts
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quote:
Originally posted by Wayward Son:
People aren't cattle or sheeple.

Agreed, sheeple don't own guns and fight to protect their right to keep them.

In general, America has had a steady, growing prosperity for the last 250 years. There are disturbing trends for the last few decades, primarily a growing Federal deficit that will eventually destroy the Federal governments ability to do anything more than process transfer payments.

However, there hasn't been a truly life changing catastrophic internal event since the Civil War. The 30's and the 60's came close, but the system actually handled pretty high internal stress without becoming dysfunctional.

There is and has been a very vocal, high intensity ongoing debate. But that's the sign of a healthy society.

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Al Wessex
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I agree with that last point, too. I would add that WWII was as transformative as any era that came before. Nobody would want to return to the opening decades of the 20th C, even if you had some notion of what they were like. It's not a debatable point how great FDRs influence was on "modern" institutions after his terms in office. The New Deal made this country along with the complete dedication to WWII. You can't undo the effects of either.

But, let's raise our voices and our arms (weaponless, of course). The more we argue, the more we are talking, and the more we are learning about and from each other. It seems like a bumpy road because it is. Sheeple need shepherds, and we aren't those kinds of people now and shouldn't ever become them...

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JWatts
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quote:
Originally posted by Al Wessex:
I agree with that last point, too. I would add that WWII was as transformative as any era that came before.

I intentionally left WWII out, because it was an external issue. The US handled WWII and more importantly its aftermath extraordinarily well.
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Wayward Son
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quote:
The more we argue, the more we are talking, and the more we are learning about and from each other. It seems like a bumpy road because it is.
Which is why this website, and those like it, are so important.

The mindless name-calling you get from most sites and from the media are useless for developing an informed electorate. But here, where we question presuppositions, ask for proof, challenge conclusions--this is how you get an informed citizenry. Polite but determined arguments. Orneriness. [Smile]

Most people may be sheeple, Daruma, but they don't last long here. [Big Grin]

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Al Wessex
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I have a *feeling* that this web site is important, which is why I linger here. I can't prove it, though, and I sometimes despair of that purpose. I declaim because I am disputatious. I argue because I am contentious. I ridicule because some things are too important to leave to uninformed or unwilling opinion. I learn in spite of myself. I get tired because nobody is listening. I'm tired as I write this, but I linger because I have a feeling about this place.
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kenmeer livermaile
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We don't want to be bothered with the responsibility of governing ourselves just as we cannot be trusted to mind our own business, so we suffer others to mind our own business for us.

It's great. We always have someone to blame and someone to take charge. I suppose this is why we have two parties.

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Al Wessex
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There should be a name for this condition, maybe a Managed Democracy instead of a Representative one.
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Colin JM0397
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Al, ditto. We continue our tilting at windmills; most days I don't know why I bother. Working @ home and no "water cooler talk" is my main reason, but there's more going on here... sometimes.

How about MDC - Managed Democratic Corptocracy.

Much less threatening than what it really is - fascism.

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Al Wessex
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==>"fascism"

There you go again...

I also like:

Competitive Democracy (I win the country *and* a pony!)
Cryptocracy (nobody understands how it works)
Creeptocracy (nothing ever seems to get finished)
Creeptocracy (look who our representatives are!)
Scriptocracy (the gov's money isn't real, as our kids will learn)
Screwtocracy (could you bend over just a little bit more?)
Oncotocracy (it has malignant growths that may or may not be treatable with a surgical strike or as a last resort by radiation)

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Colin JM0397
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Truth hurts, doesn't it?
Just because we don't have "National socialists" marching around goosestep doesn't mean it's still not so. From Wikipedia:
quote:
Fascists seek to organize a nation according to corporatist perspectives, values, and systems, including the political system and the economy.
Anyway, as Shakespeare tells us, what's in a name?
A label matters little, so you can call it what you want.

What it is not is a government of the people, by the people, and - most importantly - for the people.

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Al Wessex
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Seriously, how would you achieve that triple prepositional government? We can probably agree that it is by and of the people. Specifically, what would make it also for the people?

FWIW, Shakespeare told us a lot of stuff about ourselves, including that human nature is both good and evil.

[ July 23, 2010, 11:32 AM: Message edited by: Al Wessex ]

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Daruma28
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Daruma, we might all agree on not liking the status quo, but try to get us to agree on what we do want, and at the very best we might end up with something that looks a lot like the status quo.

I'm not interested in getting people to agree, or to "build consensus." I'm merely interested in pointing out the truth. Voting for the Reps or the Dems doesn't make a damn bit of difference, because the same agenda will be implemented regardless of which "party" is "in power."

This seems like a remarkably concise summary of your attempts to convince us all that we're sheeple. All you ever do is hammer away with radical libertarian op-eds that make exactly the same points about the alleged conspiracy over and over again and hope that the ten thousandth thread you start will get a different result to the 9999 that went before it.

[LOL] Rallan, you are most definitely a sheeple. You can't even begin to wrap your mind around the things I've been highlighting. Your derisive contempt and inability to see what is actually plainly seen.

Let's put it this way - and I say this without malice or ill will - but anyone here or anywhere else that watches corporate Television news (ANY channel, Fox, CNN, MSNBC, network news, PBS), or listens to corporate radio for their news and political debates, and considers themselves "well informed" and a "thoughtful, informed citizen" is most certainly SHEEPLE.

The masses are most certainly sheeple. We are raised to believe a whole host of lies, inaccuracies, misinformation and disinformation...by our pubic schooling system, and our mass media culture. The large corporations and non-profit foundations who have literally paid for the influence to create this artificial reality have done so quite deliberately.

I've posted time and time again my source material...especially the landmark work: The Deliberate Dumbing Down of America.

It's a matter of public record. The Rockefeller, Ford, Carnegie and Mellon Foundations all bought and paid for the right to impose their social engineering via mandatory public schooling.

They are also part of the same conglomerate who own the mass media corporations.

Yet, to put this out, IDIOTS like you Rallan, simply point the finger at me and say "there you go again, you crazy conspiracy theorist."

Keep bleating sheeple. Keep taking your soma and watching TV.

Another example for your list of kinds of authoritarians? "People cannot be trusted to govern themselves, so its our fundamental responsibility to put an end to this voting nonsense and use... ahem... other means to impose a better system on them."

LMAO. As opposed to: let's get the masses to believe that their "vote" means something...that it puts the power in the peoples hands. Hahahahaha! The jokes on you Pyrtolin!

The ruling elite have figured out long ago that by creating a charade called "democracy" they can do whatever the hell they want to, and as long as the sheeple "exercise their right to vote" they will not even consider the possibility that a revolution would be necessary.

Because that is precisely what has to happen to "fix" all that is wrong in our world today. The status quo, created and supported by BOTH Team Donkey and Team Elephant are essentially the same agenda.

As badly as the Republicans tax us, it's pretty clear now that they tax us less than the Democrats would like.

Oh cherry...this is precisely the mindset the two party dialectic is designed to produce. This is the kind of thinking that keeps everyone "left" or "right" from ever truly breaking out of this ideological prison and fail to focus on how BOTH parties collude to screw us all out of our Constitutional Representative Republic.

We live in a Fascist state. For guys like Wayward to quip "there you go again" merely demonstrates just how effective the mass media campaign has been to get the sheeple to associate the reality of fascism with the caricature of brownshirt thugs.

Fascism is nothing more than the original name for Corporatacracy.

We are certainly NOT a "free country."

We are not a "Democracy."

We are human resources, target marketed consumers and debt slaves who's entire life trajectories are dictated for the Corporatacracies profits.

Are "voting cattle" better or worse than "sheeple?" I don't really have a good grasp of the domesticated human hierarchy.

There both the same. People, expertly herded by the social engineers that create our mass media/homogenized education cultural consciousness.

I know you were being your usual snarky, snide self, but the point is still an important one. Hey tom, how does it feel to have been HERDED by the Obama machine into voting for him...only to turn around and break all the promises you voted for? LMAO...that is the name of the game.

BTW, Daruma, repetition leads to being tuned out,

[LOL]

Oh al, I know all too well. In fact, because I now understand the dialectical design of our political process, I can literally predict your own reiterations of repetition, regardless of topic under consideration. You may have different verbiage, but the left wing dialectic is utterly predictable, verboten and mostly based on appeals to emotions.

Daruma, specifically, what would you propose be done in this case to rectify the situation?

Propose? LMAO...it's far too late for that. Just trying to get people to understand reality is hard enough!

For example, lets start with the basic assertion:

Public Schooling is not about "education." It's about social engineering and indoctrination. The entire system should be abolished, and the Government should utterly have NO involvement in education.

Most sheeple read that and guffaw and say "That Daruma, he's so repetitive, he's a paranoid freak!"

Yet not a one of you (well, I think Colin has, maybe a couple of others), refuse to read something like The Deliberate Dumbing Down of America and even attempt to contemplate the implications of what that book really means in contexts of how our entire society and political system is set up.

While people want change, Daruma, they mostly want change for the better.

Funny how most people keep thinking that "voting for change" within the artificial construct of our two-party system is the key to getting this "change for the better." Because the change has not been for the better in our corrupted system at least since 1913, when this country was literally sold out to the Banking Cartel that owns the central banking system.

Agreed, sheeple don't own guns and fight to protect their right to keep them.

LMAO - precisely right. How many people in this country today own their own arms and would fight to protect them...and how many rely on the police, the national guard and other AUTHORITIES to "fight" and dictate their rights to them?

[DOH]

We don't want to be bothered with the responsibility of governing ourselves just as we cannot be trusted to mind our own business, so we suffer others to mind our own business for us.

It's great. We always have someone to blame and someone to take charge. I suppose this is why we have two parties. We don't want to be bothered with the responsibility of governing ourselves just as we cannot be trusted to mind our own business, so we suffer others to mind our own business for us.

It's great. We always have someone to blame and someone to take charge. I suppose this is why we have two parties.


Slowly...ever so slowly...I think I'm getting through to kenmeer...

[Wink]

There should be a name for this condition, maybe a Managed Democracy instead of a Representative one.

Try USA INC.

[ July 23, 2010, 06:16 PM: Message edited by: Daruma28 ]

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Al Wessex
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One day I would love to visit your planet. I imagine it is a very groovy place.
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Rallan
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quote:
Originally posted by Daruma28:
Daruma, we might all agree on not liking the status quo, but try to get us to agree on what we do want, and at the very best we might end up with something that looks a lot like the status quo.

I'm not interested in getting people to agree, or to "build consensus." I'm merely interested in pointing out the truth. Voting for the Reps or the Dems doesn't make a damn bit of difference, because the same agenda will be implemented regardless of which "party" is "in power."

This seems like a remarkably concise summary of your attempts to convince us all that we're sheeple. All you ever do is hammer away with radical libertarian op-eds that make exactly the same points about the alleged conspiracy over and over again and hope that the ten thousandth thread you start will get a different result to the 9999 that went before it.

[LOL] Rallan, you are most definitely a sheeple. You can't even begin to wrap your mind around the things I've been highlighting. Your derisive contempt and inability to see what is actually plainly seen.

I am? I vote Green as often as I vote for anything else, there are days it feels like I don't know anyone who isn't an activist or an insider (or both in the case of pretty much every gay Labor Party rank-and-filer I know), and I'd be absolutely aghast if politics down here came to more closely resemble either the Democratic or Republican positions that Americans get to choose from.

I'm derisive because, as someone who doesn't think the status quo is particularly awesome, I've had a close enough look at it to understand that your crazy-assed paranoid conspiracy theories are not simply implausible, but pathetically narcissistic. Everything in the system that you disapprove of conveniently happens to be part of a grand conspiracy. This conspiracy never adopts any ideas that you like even though (by your logic at least) they know it would be in their material best interest to do so. Nobody except people who share your opinions about the right way of doing things can see the conspiracy. All of your political and economic views are sacred and inviolable, and the only possible reason that anyone with a brain could disagree with you is because they've been conned by a giant worldwide hoax.

That's not a realistic explanation of how the world works daruma. That's one big fat ****ing masturbation fantasy where you get to stay up late getting excited by a completely imaginary persecution complex and give yourself a sense of smug satisfaction with the knowledge that everyone in the world who thinks you're wrong is either lying or scammed.

And the best thing is that for all you enjoy jerking it about people being sheeple, your entire belief structure is so utterly, utterly predictable. It's a paint-by-numbers conspiracy, a bunch of stock standard off-the-rack paranoid fantasies mixed together in a way that's so cliched it's almost a caricature of libertarianism's tinfoil hat brigade rather than the real thing. And you'll never ever see it, because just like a Birther who thinks he's not as silly as a 9/11 Truther, or a Truther who thinks he's not like those Moon Landing Hoax guys, you're labouring under the delusion that your conspiracy theory and your behaviors only match the conspiracy theorist profile perfectly because the conspiracy has done such a great job of marginalising your beliefs.

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TommySama
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"Try USA INC."

Seriously, watch this. Its awesome. The first twenty minutes is pretty standard 9/11 conspiracy, but it gets awesome. Video two is when she drops the bomb, reptile Prince William is really the emperor of inner city England, the Vatican, and New York. After a terrible event he will seize power (oh yeah, he's the antichrist). But she also talks about how the US is an english corporate entity.

This video is only an hour and he is coming from the same area as the first video and daruma.

[ July 24, 2010, 02:11 PM: Message edited by: TommySama ]

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RickyB
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"
I'm derisive because, as someone who doesn't think the status quo is particularly awesome, I've had a close enough look at it to understand that your crazy-assed paranoid conspiracy theories are not simply implausible, but pathetically narcissistic. Everything in the system that you disapprove of conveniently happens to be part of a grand conspiracy. This conspiracy never adopts any ideas that you like even though (by your logic at least) they know it would be in their material best interest to do so. Nobody except people who share your opinions about the right way of doing things can see the conspiracy. All of your political and economic views are sacred and inviolable, and the only possible reason that anyone with a brain could disagree with you is because they've been conned by a giant worldwide hoax.

That's not a realistic explanation of how the world works daruma. That's one big fat ****ing masturbation fantasy where you get to stay up late getting excited by a completely imaginary persecution complex and give yourself a sense of smug satisfaction with the knowledge that everyone in the world who thinks you're wrong is either lying or scammed.

And the best thing is that for all you enjoy jerking it about people being sheeple, your entire belief structure is so utterly, utterly predictable. It's a paint-by-numbers conspiracy, a bunch of stock standard off-the-rack paranoid fantasies mixed together in a way that's so cliched it's almost a caricature of libertarianism's tinfoil hat brigade rather than the real thing. And you'll never ever see it, because just like a Birther who thinks he's not as silly as a 9/11 Truther, or a Truther who thinks he's not like those Moon Landing Hoax guys, you're labouring under the delusion that your conspiracy theory and your behaviors only match the conspiracy theorist profile perfectly because the conspiracy has done such a great job of marginalising your beliefs. "

Um, what he said.

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Michelle
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quote:
Originally posted by Al Wessex:
I have a *feeling* that this web site is important, which is why I linger here. I can't prove it, though, and I sometimes despair of that purpose. I declaim because I am disputatious. I argue because I am contentious. I ridicule because some things are too important to leave to uninformed or unwilling opinion. I learn in spite of myself. I get tired because nobody is listening. I'm tired as I write this, but I linger because I have a feeling about this place. .

One of the single, most interesting things I have ever read on this forum was posted a few years ago; a quote attributed to a Prof. Alexander Frazer Tytler, which I find myself referring back to time and time again.The quote arguably could even apply to this topic.

quote:
A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government.It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship. The average age of the world's greatest civilizations has been 200 years.



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kenmeer livermaile
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I think Prof Tytler plays one note as a whole symphony. Democracy's chief weakness is that voters simply don't want to get involved beyond superficialities or, conversely, narrow deep issues (like the knee-jerk responses to 911).
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Michelle
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quote:
Democracy's chief weakness is that voters simply don't want to get involved beyond superficialities or, conversely, narrow deep issues (like the knee-jerk responses to 911).
I guess that is one way to look at it.

I just don't think it's feasible for one government to accommodate 360 million's expectations in a democracy. It's not a manageable number.

You have special interest from the right crashing in from one side, and special interest from the left crashing in with their demands on the other. You have the centrist being trampled and crushed in the middle like those poor folks in the tunnels at the Love Parade in Duisburg.

We are a country drunk on wants.

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Al Wessex
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That's two notes, and three makes a chord. I think Democracy, like a love affair, has many stages. We are now like lovers who after 200 years together bicker because we know each other too well. We need to reinvigorate what drew us together in the first place. Obama offered that promise, and we (some, anyway) became infatuated. Now we realize that he's like everyone else who puts his pants on one leg at a time, and already like an old lover who takes them off one leg at a time.

This is still a Democracy, it still works, but we don't have that loving feeling right now.

[ July 25, 2010, 12:22 PM: Message edited by: Al Wessex ]

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Rallan
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quote:
Originally posted by Michelle:


You have special interest from the right crashing in from one side, and special interest from the left crashing in with their demands on the other. You have the centrist being trampled and crushed in the middle like those poor folks in the tunnels at the Love Parade in Duisburg.

You could always try mandatory voting. If the Australian experience is anything to go by, it makes pandering to the base a much less profitable election strategy and encourages the major parties to be more aggressive about chasing middle-of-the-road voters.

Although you'll probably want a voting system that encourages more representation of minor parties first, otherwise mandatory voting will do nothing except accelerate the homogenization of American politics.

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