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Author Topic: DNC Chairwoman DW Schultz apparently caught in a bald faced lie
JWatts
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DNC Chairwoman Debbie Wasserman Schultz who opened the DNC yesterday has apparently made a rather politically damaging lie.

The Washington Examiner quoted her as saying the following at a training session at the DNC when instructing Jewish Democrats on how to convince fellow Jews to vote for Obama:
quote:
We know, and I’ve heard no less than Ambassador Michael Oren say this, that what the Republicans are doing is dangerous for Israel.
That's a pretty bold statement. That Ambassador Oren would make such a statement seems improbable. The ambassador of a major ally won't generally insert themselves into the host countries internal politics. But this is what she claimed.

However, Ambassador Oren responded with this:
quote:
I categorically deny that I ever characterized Republican policies as harmful to Israel. Bipartisan support is a paramount national interest for Israel, and we have great friends on both sides of the aisle.

Oops, busted!

So Shepard Smith with Fox News interviewed her last night at the convention, this was her response:
quote:
I didn’t say he said that, And unfortunately, that comment was reported by a conservative newspaper. It’s not surprising they would deliberately misquote me. What I always say is that unfortunately the Republicans have made Israel a political football, which is dangerous for Israel. And Ambassador Oren has said that we can’t ever suggest that there is any daylight between the two parties on Israel, because there isn’t. And that that’s harmful to Israel. That’s what I said, and that is accurate.

Politico

So she's been caught in a lie, the Ambassador denies making the comment. She says that a) the Ambassador didn't make the quote, and b) the "conservative newspaper. It’s not surprising they would deliberately misquote me.

The original statement was outrageous. It's apparently untrue and her response seems to be I didn't lie, the conservative newspaper lied. She has brought the ambassador of a major ally into the middle of her tale and all of this happened on the first day of the Democratic Convention. All she had to do was come out and admit she misquoted the Ambassador and while it would have been embarrassing it wouldn't be as bad as boldly claiming that the Newspaper was lying.

This isn't the first time that she's been caught out. Anderson Cooper called her out for a misrepresenting statement a couple weeks ago. She needs to resign. You can't just repeatedly make bold faced lies on national TV and deny they ever happened.

Here's a link to Anderson Cooper: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0812/80088.html

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Aris Katsaris
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quote:
"It's apparently untrue and her response seems to be I didn't lie, the conservative newspaper lied."
Why are you automatically disbelieving this claim of hers?

Shouldn't interviewers have tape-recorders or something, so that they are sure they don't mess up quotes, and so that they can be sure to be able to back up their reporting of what the interviewee said, if challenged to that effect?

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JWatts
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quote:
Originally posted by Aris Katsaris:
quote:
"It's apparently untrue and her response seems to be I didn't lie, the conservative newspaper lied."
Why are you automatically disbelieving this claim of hers?

Shouldn't interviewers have tape-recorders or something, so that they are sure they don't mess up quotes, and so that they can be sure to be able to back up their reporting of what the interviewee said, if challenged to that effect?

Yes, that's an excellent point. They should have tape recorders though sometimes it's not possible.
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LetterRip
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Here is apparently the audio, on youtube

http://hotair.com/greenroom/archives/2012/09/05/dws-attacks-washington-examiner-for-deliberately-misquoting-her-omits-her-misquoting-of-la-times/

Haven't listened though

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TomDavidson
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quote:
You can't just repeatedly make bold faced lies on national TV and deny they ever happened.
I think this is provably false.
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JWatts
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I got interrupted before I finished the above. There is a link to the audio in the original Politico story.

quote:
Originally posted by TomDavidson:
quote:
You can't just repeatedly make bold faced lies on national TV and deny they ever happened.
I think this is provably false.
Yes, I think I have to concede the point in the face of the evidence. [Wink]

I'll restate, You shouldn't just repeatedly make bold faced lies on national TV and deny they ever happened. Furthermore, DWS is in an appointed position. She's wasn't elected to be the Chairwoman. The Democrat's should send her packing promptly.

I imagine every news outlet at the convention is actively trying to get her in front of the camera today and I suspect she'll be incommunicado for the rest of the day if not the week. I certainly don't expect to see her face on the Sunday talk shows this week.

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Adam Masterman
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So, have her words been verified? What she allegedly said isn't necessarily referring to Republican *policies*; it could just as easily be referring to their politicization of the issue. So Oren's statement does not necessarily contradict Schultz's.

Now, I'm not exactly going to gasp with surprise if a political hack wound up telling a lie. However, right now the situation seems to be the word of a political hack versus the word of a partisan media source. In other words, reliable liar vs. reliable liar. Is there any verification for either side's claims?

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scifibum
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I listened to the audio on LR's link and it is clear that the quote is accurate. There's even a bit of surrounding audio; it's not entirely out of context.

However, she went on to say that there is not and should never be "daylight between" the two major parties on Israel.

In fact, after listening to the audio, I can't even tell what point she was trying to make. In particular I don't know what this is supposed to mean:

"...what the Republicans are doing is dangerous for Israel."

So...Is there bipartisan support for Israel or not? Is "what the Republicans are doing" creating daylight between the parties, or..? The Examiner article claims she's referring to GOP criticism of Obama's record on Israel.

I'm not very impressed with the sloppy, inaccurate name dropping, and then lying about being misquoted. I don't know anything else about her, though, so I'm not sure if she should GTFO or not.

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JWatts
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quote:
Originally posted by scifibum:
I'm not very impressed with the sloppy, inaccurate name dropping, and then lying about being misquoted. I don't know anything else about her, though, so I'm not sure if she should GTFO or not.

Also relevant to the story:

She's the DNC Chairwoman & probably their most visible presence on TV.
She's on the Sunday morning political weekly round ups routinely.
She was called out by Anderson Cooper during a CNN interview misrepresenting Republican's two weeks ago. During the exchange she didn't really clarify her comments nor back down despite several increasingly incredulous queries from Cooper.
She was in the act of handing out a document labeled "Myths versus Facts" when she put words in the Israeli ambassadors mouth.
quote:
We have the Myths vs Facts document which addresses a lot of the typical baloney that is spewed by Republicans.
She dragged the Ambassador of a major ally into this tale, and he was forced to issue a denial.


I can't imagine anybody taking her seriously from this point forward when she starts talking about Republican lies.

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Adam Masterman
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Just followed the links; she's a liar. Where the heck did this hack come from?
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TomDavidson
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I'll give you three guesses for what state she's from, Adam. You'll only need one.
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G3
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quote:
Originally posted by Adam Masterman:
Just followed the links; she's a liar. Where the heck did this hack come from?

She officially leads the Democratic Party having been apointed by Obama .

quote:
“In selecting Debbie to lead our party, President Obama noted her tenacity, her strength, her fighting spirit and her ability to overcome adversity,” Biden wrote.

“President Obama expressed great admiration for her as a leader, and he was honored that she accepted this important challenge on behalf of the Democratic Party.”

In short, this "hack" came straight from none other than Barry himself. She is the face, voice and mind of Democrats.

[ September 05, 2012, 12:29 PM: Message edited by: G3 ]

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Adam Masterman
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Yup; had to double-check my guess, but only because it was such an obvious answer.

I'm also curious why it would be considered a good thing that the two parties have no difference in the Israel policies. We know in practice that they do (or, at least, different administrations do), but even in general, shouldn't the public have a choice? I, for one, am not exactly satisfied with my country being an accomplice to apartheid.

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Adam Masterman
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quote:
Originally posted by G3:
In short, this "hack" came straight from none other than Barry himself. She is the face, voice and mind of Democrats.

[edited]

[ September 06, 2012, 07:23 PM: Message edited by: OrneryMod ]

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G3
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[edited, merely a response to a post that was edited]

[ September 06, 2012, 07:24 PM: Message edited by: OrneryMod ]

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Adam Masterman
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Apologies to the forum for engaging Gx; mod, could you remove the previous two posts?
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G3
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[Edited]

[ September 06, 2012, 07:25 PM: Message edited by: OrneryMod ]

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Adam Masterman
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To be clear, I was apologizing (to the forum) for calling you a hack, instead of just saying that you are unfailingly dishonest and that your posts are buffoon-ishly partisan, giving you no ground to call anyone else a hack. Had I not broken a forum rule, you would have far less cover for blatantly (though ineptly) attacking my religious orientation. Then, perhaps, mod would give you another ban, since you have abandoned any pretense of respecting the forum rules, leaving us yet again with having to deal with your issues.
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velcro
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Here are the facts.

Oren has said repeatedly that making Israel a partisan issue is dangerous for Israel. In other words,
{making Israel a partisan issue in the US}= {dangerous for Israel, according to Michael Oren}
I can provide sources if requested.

Republicans are making Israel a partisan issue. (e.g. Romney said Obama is "throwing Israel under the bus". In other words
{making Israel a partisan issue}={what Republicans are doing}

Therefore, by transitive property

{what Republicans are doing}={dangerous for Israel, according to Michael Oren}

So her initial statement was correct. As would be a statement that what Democrats are doing is a danger to Israel. If they were making Israel a partisan issue. Oren didn't say it directly, but what she said it is true.

Was it stupid to put Oren on the spot like that ? Certainly.
Was Oren correct in denying there was an actual quote? Yes.
Was it really, really stupid to call it a misquote, rather than out of context (which it certainly was). Oh, yeah.

But her statement is true, in specifics and in spirit. And even if Michael Oren didn't say it directly, when Romney says Obama is throwing Israel under the bus, it is a danger to Israel, and Oren knows it.

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JWatts
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quote:
Originally posted by velcro:
So her initial statement was correct. As would be a statement that what Democrats are doing is a danger to Israel. If they were making Israel a partisan issue. Oren didn't say it directly, but what she said it is true.

Well if you ignore the facts that:

a) She first claimed he said it
b) He absolutely denies saying it
c) She later denied ever saying it

then yes that would be true.

quote:
DNC Chairwoman Debbie Wasserman Schultz
We know, and I’ve heard no less than Ambassador Michael Oren say this, that what the Republicans are doing is dangerous for Israel.

quote:
Israeli Ambassador Oren:
I categorically deny that I ever characterized Republican policies as harmful to Israel. Bipartisan support is a paramount national interest for Israel, and we have great friends on both sides of the aisle.

quote:
DNC Chairwoman Debbie Wasserman Schultz
And I didn’t say he said that, And unfortunately, that comment was reported by a conservative newspaper. It’s not surprising they would deliberately misquote me

But I'm pretty sure if you ignore all of the relevant facts you can claim anything to be true.


quote:
Originally posted by velcro:
But her statement is true, in specifics and in spirit.

That's a bold statement Velcro, very bold. I applaud your conviction in the face of all evidence to the contrary. [Cool]
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G3
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quote:
Originally posted by velcro:
But her statement is true, in specifics and in spirit.

wow! Just incredible. [LOL]

I mean ...incredible. I don't know if we should be laughing or crying.

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G3
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quote:
Originally posted by Adam Masterman:
To be clear, I was apologizing (to the forum) for calling you a hack, instead of just saying that you are unfailingly dishonest and that your posts are buffoon-ishly partisan, giving you no ground to call anyone else a hack. Had I not broken a forum rule, you would have far less cover for blatantly (though ineptly) attacking my religious orientation. Then, perhaps, mod would give you another ban, since you have abandoned any pretense of respecting the forum rules, leaving us yet again with having to deal with your issues.

To be clear, I was not attacking your religious orientation. [edited]

[ September 06, 2012, 07:30 PM: Message edited by: OrneryMod ]

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Pyrtolin
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You're using an ambiguous "it" below to make a false case:

quote:
a) She first claimed he said it
"It" = Making Israel a partisan issue, which Velcro noted (without sourcing, to be fair) Oren has claimed is a problem a number of times.

quote:
b) He absolutely denies saying it
"It" = The actual policies that Repubicans support; he very clearly identified the policies as something he supported, and actively avoided addressing their political behavior.

So he denied something, it it was very explicitly something entirely different than what DWS was talking about.

quote:
c) She later denied ever saying it
"It" = Saying that Oren had a problem with the policies that Republicans supported, she confirmed that any attempt to cast her as talking about the policies that they advocated was an egregious misquotation and repeated that she had been talking about their partisan political behavior instead.

And yer, despite that being very well laid out in the quotes you provided,, you keep insisting on claiming that she said something that's not in any quote you've provided here. Not once does she say that Oren claimed that the GOP's policies are dangerous to Israel, only that the kind of partisan behavior that it is engaging in is.

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