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» The Ornery American Forum » General Comments » Woz says much of the Jobs movie was lies (Page 2)

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Author Topic: Woz says much of the Jobs movie was lies
scifibum
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quote:
Originally posted by TomDavidson:
I've actually been pleasantly surprised by the quality of voice recognition. I haven't had to fully type a text in almost four months.

I've had less luck, although occasionally it flawlessly transcribes whole paragraphs, and those times are nice. The bigger problem is that I rarely want to be heard talking into my phone.
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TomDavidson
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*laugh* I just said that rhyme into Google Now and it immediately gave me back "mares eat oats and does eat oats and little lambs eat ivy," then linked to a video of a six-year-old singing the song and the Wikipedia entry for "Mairzy Doats." [Smile]

In fact, it handled "she sells seashells down by the seashore" and "tweedle beetle bottle puddle paddle battle." I suspect they use tongue twisters in testing.

[ January 22, 2014, 08:51 PM: Message edited by: TomDavidson ]

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OpsanusTau
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I refused to get a smartphone at all until this particular droid (yeah, I was still using T9 a year and a half ago, you gotta problem with that?) so it might be true that I wouldn't see much change in function with a different phone.

My other big criterion is that I need a phone that will survive the number of times I am going to drop it on the floor. Usually 2-3 times a week, sometimes more. I've given up on pretending this will not happen, so now I just need a phone that won't break.

I'm sure at some point my phone company will offer me a good deal on a phone that I want that also runs a late-enough version of android. I do SO hate shopping for phones...

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MattP
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Ops - possible new Android slider on the horizon:
http://www.engadget.com/2014/01/16/lg-optimus-f3q-leak/

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Gaoics79
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Saw part of this movie recently on a plane. The opening scene pissed me off. Steve Jobs standing before an applauding audience announcing the power to hold 1,000 songs in his hand.

I think the people who created the movie believe that Apple invented the mp3 player.

You know, it bugs me that a company like Apple gets as much credit as it does for innovation. I'm with Tom; they've innovated precious little on the technology side.

Compare them to Google, a company that has repeatedly, consistently innovated new and amazing technologies for years. But Apple makes a prettier phone and we are supposed to swoon in awe. What's that? Did Steve Jobs invent the cell-phone too?

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scifibum
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Google gets their due, to be fair.
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KidTokyo
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Jason,

I think what matters is that they invented the mp3 player and the smartphone that everyone wanted -- devices which worked very well as opposed to simply working. You're correct that it's not cutting-edge tech innovation, its refinement and perfectionism. But there's a world of difference between a smoothly operable device and one that's functional-but-fussy.

I *do* kind of stand in awe that such meticulous attention to very small design details results in such a greatly improved user experience.

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LetterRip
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KidTokyo,

except they didn't invent the mp3 player everyone wanted - they bought the two companies that had designed the hardware and the OS. They had zero innovation related to that device (they did some quality assurance work - ie requiring some latency reductions for certain operations before shipping). It is absurd to claim any innovation on their behalf for those purchases. A large checkbook is not innovation.

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KidTokyo
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LR,

Fine, they did what all big companies do -- better than other companies did. Creating the final product out of different parts is still creativity. The refinements matter. I don't get why Apple is singled out for entirely normal corporate behavior, as though what they do is uniquely suspect, evil, or deceptive.

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JoshuaD
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LR: They also knew which two companies to buy, and exactly how to combine them in the right way.

Software and hardware design is hard. It's easy to belittle what Apple did. The stuff they created revolutionized the way a lot of people think about phones and digital music.

You can say that they used technology other people designed and I won't disagree on the facts. I will disagree that this fact somehow denigrates the accomplishments apple made.

That being said, they're still very much the bad guy.

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LetterRip
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JoshuaD,

they weren't the only major corporation with the interest in Pixo and PortalPlayer. IBM (among others) had also sought to license the same hardware reference design by PortalPlayer and the same OS and interface design from Pixo.

Substantially the same hardware and software (indeed the same specific hardware with the same specific OS and UI design) was going to be produced regardless of who the licensor was.

Apple definitely added 'polish' to the design (ie the focus on latency), that had it been a different licensor might not have occured.

I'm not 'belittling' Apple. I don't think they should get nearly as much credit as they generally do for the iPod.

KidTokyo,

I'm not 'singling them out'. If some corporation is claimed to be innovative when the claim is based on a case of primarily rebranding of a purchase and I'm aware of it, I'd object there as well. Yes it is a common flaw to claim innovation for corporations that make acquisitions.

Most drug companies have little or no innovation either - they license the designs that the universities, governments, and small corporations have innovated and then bring the product to market. Or they reverse engineer an innovative drug and look for methods around the patents.

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LetterRip
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Note that saying that Apple wasn't primarily the responsible party that should be credited with the innovations of the iPod doesn't mean that I think that Apple doesn't innovate.

They have had a great deal of innovation in the case design and UI design areas. They have done a number of important innovations in integrated hardware designs in general.

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KidTokyo
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The design and polish is what makes all the difference for me. Look at some of the earlier MP3 players. Ok, they played mp3s, they had the capacity, but they were huge and ugly and festooned with Walkman-style switches and buttons stuck in any old place.

The ipod was small and light and you could operate everything with your thumb with effortless, brisk movements. That's why people love them. They accommodate the user rather than the other way around. I have an ipod that is literally 12 years old and it still works -- I used it and updated it right up until I got an ipad in 2011. That's an impressive run, no?

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TomDavidson
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quote:
The ipod was small and light and you could operate everything with your thumb with effortless, brisk movements.
Provided you did all the real heavy lifting in iTunes. *shudder*
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AI Wessex
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Hmmph, *you're* the grump, not me.
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KidTokyo
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Itunes used to give me grief but nowadays works just fine, and has for years. Windows Media however is still completely horrible. I haven't tried anything else.
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JoshuaD
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I'm still using winamp (5.61) for music on windows.
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Gaoics79
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quote:
I think what matters is that they invented the mp3 player and the smartphone that everyone wanted -- devices which worked very well as opposed to simply working. You're correct that it's not cutting-edge tech innovation, its refinement and perfectionism. But there's a world of difference between a smoothly operable device and one that's functional-but-fussy.
And if Apple were given credit where credit is due, we wouldn't have a problem here. I give Apple credit for their design, their interface, their marketing. You can't argue with the results - they became dominant in the mp3 player market to a point where many people today actually believe they invented it.

This isn't some minor quibble on my part. If there were just a handful of devices here and there and mp3 players were an obscure geeky technology at the time the IPOD came out, I'd be less of a stickler. But MP3 players were common as dirt by the time the IPOD was released. You could buy them at gas stations on key chains.

1,000 songs in the palm of your hand? That existed already at the time of the IPOD's release; such devices could be bought in every Best Buy and Radio Shack in the world. Apple didn't make this mainstream with the IPOD - It was already mainstream.

It would be like watching a movie where Steve Jobs announced: "imagine the power to have a telephone conversation anywhere in the world" and waved the Iphone around to thunderous applause. Wouldn't that be a tad ridiculous? Where does the movie get off implying that Steve Jobs "imagined" the concept of the mp3 player. He did no such thing, anymore than he imagined the concept of the cellphone. This is just rewriting history. I can give them a pass on stuff that happened in the 1980's 30 years ago, but for f's sake, we're talking about 2001.

It's like giving Mark Zuckerberg credit for inventing e-mail.

[ February 01, 2014, 12:26 PM: Message edited by: jasonr ]

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AI Wessex
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Credit where it's due: Zuckerberg made friend a verb and like a noun. Jobs never managed to do that.
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