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Author Topic: Student interrogated and suspend for wearing Halloween costume
Rafi
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quote:
A female high school student awaits a disciplinary hearing and could face expulsion for wearing a Halloween costume to school that prompted officials to lock down the building Wednesday.

An unnamed female student was spotted in the hallway at Pueblo County High School early yesterday morning wearing a gas mask and trench coat, and a classmate reported her to school officials, The Pueblo Chieftain reports.

The teen was hauled to the office where she was interrogated by the police, who also placed the school on lockdown for about an hour. The Pueblo County Sheriff’s Office SWAT team, which was training near the school, also responded in full camouflage gear and a large armored vehicle to sweep the building for anything dangerous or suspicious. They found nothing, according to the news site.

A spokesman for the sheriff’s office told KKTV the girl said the outfit was a Halloween costume. She wasn’t carrying any weapons.

“Incidents like this cannot be overlooked and must be taken serious,” Pueblo County superintendent Ed Smith told the Chieftain. “Our concern is always for the students.”
Smith said the student, who acted alone, was suspended and faces a disciplinary hearing in which she could be expelled, though the school board would have to approve that decision.

I am not sure why her Whitehouse invite has not been extended yet. Any theories?
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Pyrtolin
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Because at this point it's only a bit of localized stupidity that hasn't escalated beyond the fact that you can easily dig for local news anywhere?

I can imagine that she should be up against dress code violations for wearing a costume outside of an event were such was expected, but the school should take responsibility for its own absurd over-reaction to that relatively minor violation. Looks like they at least stopped short of having her arrested and hassled by the police.

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AI Wessex
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I didn't see in the article if she said it was a clock. Perhaps she can be invited to attend and wear the gas mask at the next GOP debate.
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TomDavidson
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If she'd taken pieces of an air filter and crammed them into her gas mask, then I'd be impressed. [Wink]
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scifibum
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My kid brought peanuts to a peanut free day care, and not even the mayor had anything to say about it. [Frown]
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JoshCrow
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quote:
Originally posted by scifibum:
My kid brought peanuts to a peanut free day care, and not even the mayor had anything to say about it. [Frown]

I think it's important that we call this for what it is - an act of terrorism, deliberately targeting a civilian population. [Exploding]
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Fenring
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Anybody want a peanut?
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AI Wessex
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This does raise the very serious question that I read on the web - and I'm not usually a conspiracy theorist - that if someone heard beeping -- as from perhaps a clock -- coming from inside a gas mask left by this girl --- if she even really is a girl given that we are not the kinder gender nation we was once we were! --- and it exploded when they picked it up releasing mustard flavored peanut gas, well then, there you have it...Benghazi!
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Rafi
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quote:
Originally posted by Pyrtolin:
Because at this point it's only a bit of localized stupidity that hasn't escalated beyond the fact that you can easily dig for local news anywhere?

I can imagine that she should be up against dress code violations for wearing a costume outside of an event were such was expected, but the school should take responsibility for its own absurd over-reaction to that relatively minor violation. Looks like they at least stopped short of having her arrested and hassled by the police.

Nope, that rationalization is not accurate. For example, she was "interrogated" by police for an hour. I think we need to keep the facts grounded in the event here.

We all know damn well why she's not a sudden star.

quote:
Originally posted by Rafi:
If you think Mike Jones from First Baptist would have gotten an invite to the Whitehouse, you are ignoring the facts.

What is gas mask girl's name and why is it not published? If it eventually does come out, do you think it could change the narrative?
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TomDavidson
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I'm sure it's not published because a) she wasn't arrested, so it's not a matter of public record; and b) her parents didn't Tweet about it while identifying her.

I'm assuming the school is not in fact going to expel her; if they do, that's a genuine outrage.

What I find curious is that not a single person here has yet speculated whether or not she wore a gas mask to deliberately cause trouble, or even to deliberately play up the difference in response between these two cases. Do you think she was a moron, Rafi, or a smart-ass kid with activist parents?

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D.W.
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A: trouble maker
B: dumb to think people wouldn't freak
C: all of the above

The resin you don't see the speculation is nobody rushed in to say she was mistreated or to leverage the story for political gain. And because they're is no answer D.

[ October 09, 2015, 09:58 AM: Message edited by: D.W. ]

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Pyrtolin
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quote:
Originally posted by TomDavidson:
I'm sure it's not published because a) she wasn't arrested, so it's not a matter of public record; and b) her parents didn't Tweet about it while identifying her.

The last part is one of the important differences. It's not getting national attention because, as yet, people are choosing not to take the actions to raise the issue on a national level.
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Rafi
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The question you are avoiding is, why?
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Pyrtolin
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quote:
Originally posted by Rafi:
The question you are avoiding is, why?

You' have to ask her parents that one. I'm guessing they're not interested in all the hassle that comes from escalating the incident.

It's possible they want the attention but don't realize that they have to put in the work to get it rather than magically waiting for it to come if they don't work to make it happen.

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AI Wessex
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I think Tom's question needs to be answered...
quote:
What I find curious is that not a single person here has yet speculated whether or not she wore a gas mask to deliberately cause trouble, or even to deliberately play up the difference in response between these two cases.

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Fenring
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quote:
Originally posted by AI Wessex:
I think Tom's question needs to be answered...
quote:
What I find curious is that not a single person here has yet speculated whether or not she wore a gas mask to deliberately cause trouble, or even to deliberately play up the difference in response between these two cases.

It's because no claims have been made about her by either side. It was the sensationalizing of Ahmed's case, with the associated claims being put forwards as facts (namely that this was racism in America at work) that spurred on some people here to question that narrative. For my part, at least, it was a response to a nation-level claim already in play. Without the original claim there would have been nothing to trigger any kind of counter-claim.
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JoshCrow
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quote:
Originally posted by Fenring:
For my part, at least, it was a response to a nation-level claim already in play. Without the original claim there would have been nothing to trigger any kind of counter-claim.

Yep, this. I got involved only because I saw all kinds of people coming to conclusions without facts, presenting Ahmed as an exhibit in a larger cultural issue. But as has been the case in a number of such incidents lately, there were enough muddy facts to merit more skepticism on the specifics.

Which is not to say there isn't a larger cultural issue! Just that they rally around cases that are ambiguous at best. Michael Brown's case comes to mind.

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Pete at Home
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quote:
Originally posted by Pyrtolin:
Because at this point it's only a bit of localized stupidity that hasn't escalated beyond the fact that you can easily dig for local news anywhere?

I can imagine that she should be up against dress code violations for wearing a costume outside of an event were such was expected, but the school should take responsibility for its own absurd over-reaction to that relatively minor violation. Looks like they at least stopped short of having her arrested and hassled by the police.

In your cosmos, being detained and interrogated by cops for over an hour isn't "hassle"? Is this based on some officious sociological definition of arrest and hassle that depends on the detainees skin color and minority oppressed status?
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Pete at Home
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quote:
Originally posted by AI Wessex:
I think Tom's question needs to be answered...
quote:
What I find curious is that not a single person here has yet speculated whether or not she wore a gas mask to deliberately cause trouble, or even to deliberately play up the difference in response between these two cases.

That's because there is actually a believable explanation (Halloween). Clock boy lied and claimed he built a clock, when in fact he just took the cover off a clock. The answers to Tom's question is that there's less reason to speculate when the kid's explanation is plausible.
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Pyrtolin
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quote:
Originally posted by Pete at Home:
In your cosmos, being detained and interrogated by cops for over an hour isn't "hassle"? Is this based on some officious sociological definition of arrest and hassle that depends on the detainees skin color and minority oppressed status?

Or, perhaps, I was going on the fact that she wasn't arrested, and being questions wasn't mentioned till later in the conversation?

Even so, being questioned, which leaves her the option of walking out if they're not going to arrest her, is a lesser degree of hassle. That also misses the point that she and her family are not making as much of an effort to make a big deal of it, so it's not being pushed to the national stage.

There are many false and very misleading suggestions in this and similar conversations that people operating at the national level go hunting for causes to advance, which is absurdly false. People at the local level choose to make national issues of them or not and bring them to the attention of national groups for help.

"Why is nobody making a big deal out of this?" is at best ignorant, but generally outright deceptive question. It's a form of concern trolling, in this case glossing over the fact that people aren't making a big deal about it, because the local people affected by it have not chosen to push the issue rather than the issue being "ignored" by an imaginary effort from the top to find cases to make a big deal out of.

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Pyrtolin
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quote:
Originally posted by Pete at Home:
quote:
Originally posted by AI Wessex:
I think Tom's question needs to be answered...
quote:
What I find curious is that not a single person here has yet speculated whether or not she wore a gas mask to deliberately cause trouble, or even to deliberately play up the difference in response between these two cases.

That's because there is actually a believable explanation (Halloween). Clock boy lied and claimed he built a clock, when in fact he just took the cover off a clock. The answers to Tom's question is that there's less reason to speculate when the kid's explanation is plausible.
So a Halloween costume, any time of the year, is plausible (without regard to barely being in the same month as Halloween, never mind at a function where costumes were invited? But any kid that makes a thing in shop class that includes an off the shelf mechanism in it is lying if the characterize it as "making a clock", despite the fact that body of any given clock is as much part of the clock as the mechanism?

In both cases, the schools overreacted absurdly and should own up to that, but otherwise the biggest difference between the two of them is that, in the former, his family chose to push the issue into the national spotlight by reaching out for support and attention, while hers did not.

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TomDavidson
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quote:
Clock boy lied and claimed he built a clock, when in fact he just took the cover off a clock.
You know, Pete, this is inexplicably hostile and childish of you. The kid rehomed some clock parts and soldered them together, and you're casting his pride in that tinkering as "lying." Get over it, man.
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AI Wessex
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quote:
Originally posted by AI Wessex:
I think Tom's question needs to be answered...
quote:
What I find curious is that not a single person here has yet speculated whether or not she wore a gas mask to deliberately cause trouble, or even to deliberately play up the difference in response between these two cases.

Still no answer. It matters *a lot* what she would say and what the school administration and police believed. Saying that, however, she hasn't been shown to have done anything other than pranked her classmates.
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Pete at Home
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quote:
Originally posted by TomDavidson:
quote:
Clock boy lied and claimed he built a clock, when in fact he just took the cover off a clock.
You know, Pete, this is inexplicably hostile and childish of you. The kid rehomed some clock parts and soldered them together, and you're casting his pride in that tinkering as "lying." Get over it, man.
You know, Tom, that was typically obtuse of you. One obvious explanation: the articles I read did not mention any soldering. If what you claim is true, then what he said would not be a lie. But given how you soldered what I said to meet your conclusions, I am dubious about your presentation.
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scifibum
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Even if he did nothing but take the clock apart and attach the guts to a new case, it's still a bit harsh to say he's a liar, IMO. People who plug a $3 motor into a painted board and attach the arms say they "made a clock" too.
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The Drake
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I suspect there would have been a different reaction had the girl been marched out in handcuffs. Or maybe not. The internet and media are pretty fickle about what gets escalated, and it does indeed depend on context that will get people riled up. The number of people defending the school in the case of the concocted clock probably amplified things.

Additionally, there is the inherent stupidity of the staff not knowing what a bomb would look like as well as the police that amplified the retweets, with hilarious quotes like "looked like a movie bomb"

Our failing science and education programs are also part of the context and scrutiny, especially in the case of anything potentially dangerous. Some high school chemistry classes have been stripped of any serious reagents, like nitric acid, sulfuric acid, methyl alcohol, or really anything else that might be more interesting than litmus paper. And they might not be wrong to do so, as student lab safety is bad in many places with overcrowding, incomplete and inadequate ventilation, and poor or absent safety training.

Simply many topics that resonate that are all part of the first story, and not about a girl who wore a gas mask.

Given the lack of national interest, I find it curious how we're even talking about this in our forum, which seems the more interesting question at least to me. I've hunted quite a bit, and I can't find a mention outside of the local area including retweets, etc.

I did have quite a bit of fun reading this story about a man wearing a stormtrooper costume got arrested for hanging around a school with a plastic gun.

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Pete at Home
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quote:
Originally posted by scifibum:
Even if he did nothing but take the clock apart and attach the guts to a new case, it's still a bit harsh to say he's a liar, IMO. People who plug a $3 motor into a painted board and attach the arms say they "made a clock" too.

The sources I saw did not mention the shop class. If I had seen that, I would not have called him a liar.

It is obvious that regardless of what is said Al is going to pretend that no one has answered Tom's question.

Yet another answer (aside from factual belieability of the respective stories and insufficient isn't facts, another reason why no one "questions" whether the girl was trying to scare people, is because there's no bloody question about it. A Halloween costume or prank is supposed to invoke fear, by it's nature.

If Tom meant to say, question if she meant to start a panic, well no. Even the sight of someone who appears to believe that there is poison in the air does not evoke the same sort of fear as a device that appears to be a bomb. (I was in the areba during the Cody Judy incident in the 1990s and know what it's like to be held by the 'this is a bomb" threat ...

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TomDavidson
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Huh. You and I have very different cultural biases, Pete. Not only would I say that the majority of modern Halloween costumes are NOT designed to cause fear, but I personally am much more afraid of bioweapons and poison gas than bombs.

[ October 12, 2015, 08:45 PM: Message edited by: TomDavidson ]

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AI Wessex
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Pete, I find it interesting that everyone seems willing to accept her explanation that it was a somewhat provocative Halloween costume and look no further to find a deeper motivation. OTOH, you called Ahmed a liar and others have called him a moron, dullard and hoaxster.

For my part, I think she got the reaction she wanted with a prank, whereas there is no evidence to suggest that Ahmed did anything but bring a clock to school to show his teacher.

Funny that.

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The Drake
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quote:
as a device that appears to be a bomb
Except that any reasonable person with an ounce of sense wouldn't interpret an LED clock to be a bomb?
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Pete at Home
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quote:
Originally posted by AI Wessex:
Pete, I find it interesting that everyone seems willing to accept her explanation that it was a somewhat provocative Halloween costume and look no further to find a deeper motivation. OTOH, you called Ahmed a liar and others have called him a moron, dullard and hoaxster.

For my part, I think she got the reaction she wanted with a prank, whereas there is no evidence to suggest that Ahmed did anything but bring a clock to school to show his teacher.

Funny that.

I find nothing interesting or new here at all. As usual you are selectively parsing and manipulating my statements to imply racism islamophobia and other crimes against political correctness. You are a one trick pony on that theme.

The facts fit my general experience of a Halloween prank.

And I have already said that Achmed's story becomes plausible in light of the facts about soldering and the shop class (I trust sci-fi more that Tom).

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Pete at Home
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quote:
Originally posted by The Drake:
quote:
as a device that appears to be a bomb
Except that any reasonable person with an ounce of sense wouldn't interpret an LED clock to be a bomb?
Why?

Not sure what you mean by "sense.". People don't have esp. We generally group facts according to our experience. That's why the soldering and shop teacher facts make Ahmed's story more plausible. And aalso why Halloween costume jibes.

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Pete at Home
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quote:
Originally posted by TomDavidson:
Huh. You and I have very different cultural biases, Pete. Not only would I say that the majority of modern Halloween costumes are NOT designed to cause fear, but I personally am much more afraid of bioweapons and poison gas than bombs.

OK
Well in Utah, Georgia, Nevada, and Detroit, people often dress up as witches, ghosts, and other fear provokers. My son dresses up as a nazgul, another like one of those zombie dudes from the maze runner series. I danced with a girl who wore a wedding dress with fake blood around the throat. What do they do in Wisconsin? Dress up as big pieces of cheese?

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TomDavidson
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We see a fair number of vampires, I suppose, and a handful of zombies. Last year we had a bumper crop of astronauts, cowboys, and Disney princesses, though; they outnumbered the "scary" costumes around 4:1.
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Pete at Home
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If Achmed came to school during October with a mock suicide vest and remote, and said it was a Halloween costume, I would believe him.

Note that something being a Halloween prank does not preclude it from being harmful or criminal. So buying the girl's story does not mean letting her o$f the hook.

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Pete at Home
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quote:
Originally posted by TomDavidson:
We see a fair number of vampires, I suppose, and a handful of zombies. Last year we had a bumper crop of astronauts, cowboys, and Disney princesses, though; they outnumbered the "scary" costumes around 4:1.

After Miley Cyrus, Kinsey Logan, Belle Knox, etc, seeing a child dressing as a Disney princess should scare the shot out of anyone, Tom. That's just the female equivalent of a suicide bomber.
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Pete at Home
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"Trick or treat" is itself an implied threat to vandalize your home if you don't buy them off with candy. [Smile]
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Pete at Home
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1999 Halloween, I dressed up Thing One as the Y2k bug.
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Fenring
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quote:
Originally posted by Pete at Home:
That's why the soldering and shop teacher facts make Ahmed's story more plausible. And aalso why Halloween costume jibes.

Uh, sorry Pete, but you've mentioned 'shop class' several times now...where does this fact originate? I've heard nothing about a shop teacher or shop class. As far as I knew it was an unsolicited project Ahmed just felt like doing.
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Pyrtolin
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quote:
Originally posted by Pete at Home:
quote:
Originally posted by The Drake:
quote:
as a device that appears to be a bomb
Except that any reasonable person with an ounce of sense wouldn't interpret an LED clock to be a bomb?
Why?


Because the only reason to put an LED clock on a "bomb" is to create a sense of tension for a viewing audience. It doesn't make any sense to use it as an indicator of a real bomb.

quote:
And aalso why Halloween costume jibes.
Except that it wasn't Halloween. Heck, there are still more than two weeks to go till we get there.
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