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Author Topic: GOP House leadership should resign
Liberal
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Trent Lott resigned from his leadership position for less than this. Hastert covered for a pedophile for over a year and then he lied about it. For all we know, this means he is sympathetic with Foley and is a pedophile himself, but forget that and just deal with the cover-up and the lie about when he knew about it. Why should this man be trusted to be speaker of the house and third in line for the Presidency when he openly admits that he lied? The whip and majority leader should resign also, they were in the small loop.

Keep in mind there were many other emails about other pages that Hastert and others knew about before this "innocent sounding" one.

quote:
WASHINGTON — House Republican leaders should have kept Democrats in the loop _ and now must conduct a thorough investigation _ about the inappropriate e-mails that led to Rep. Mark Foley's resignation, a top Democrat said Sunday.

"This should be investigated objectively. I think the Democratic leadership should have been told 10 months ago," said Rep. Jane Harman of California, top Democrat on the House Intelligence Committee. "I gather that basically nothing was done except that Foley was warned."

Foley, R-Fla., quit Congress on Friday after the disclosure of the e-mails to a teenage boy who was a former congressional page and the lawmaker's sexually suggestive instant messages to other pages.

White House aide Dan Bartlett said the allegations against Foley were shocking and that President Bush had not been informed previously about the e-mails. Bartlett said there was no need for an independent outside investigation.

"The leadership appear to be very aggressive in pursuing this investigation," he said. "I think that's the best place for this investigation to go forward."

House Speaker Dennis Hastert, R-Ill., said at first he had learned only last week about the e-mails Foley sent to a page. Hastert later acknowledged that aides referred the matter to the authorities last fall.

Hastert's office said, however, it was only aware the e-mails were "over-friendly," and asked for a review by the House board that oversees pages late last year.


Hastert, Boehner and Majority Whip Roy Blunt, R-Mo., said in a joint statement Saturday that "the improper communications between Congressman Mark Foley and former House congressional pages is unacceptable and abhorrent. It is an obscene breach of trust."

Foley, who is 52 and single, was co-chairman of the Congressional Missing and Exploited Children's Caucus. In a statement released by his office Friday, the lawmaker said, "I am deeply sorry and I apologize for letting down my family and the people of Florida I have had the privilege to represent."

The House voted Friday to refer the matter for investigation by the House ethics committee. Democrats said Sunday any investigation must be thorough, but completed quickly.

"I am not comfortable with where we're leaving this. It's not my call what we do next, but more needs to be done," Harman said. "There's been a Republican investigation for 24 hours of Republican activity, I just don't think that that is adequate."

Rep. John Murtha, D-Pa., faulted the House GOP leadership for not acting sooner. "It's outrageous," he said, citing reports indicating they were told months ago. "We have an obligation to protect these young pages. ... It really makes me nervous that they might have tried to cover this up."

He called for a quick investigation before the November elections to "hold people accountable," but said there was no need for an outside investigation. "I think it's something the ethics committee can handle. ... It's something that can be handled internally."

Rep. Thomas Reynolds, head of the House Republican election effort, said Saturday he told Hastert months ago about concerns Foley sent inappropriate messages to a teenage boy. Reynolds, R-N.Y., is under attack from Democrats who say he did too little to protect the boy.

Republican leaders say it's their duty to ensure House pages' safety, and are now creating a toll-free hot line for pages and their families to call to confidentially report any incidents. They also will consider adopting new rules on communications between lawmakers and pages.

The boy who received the e-mails was 16 in the summer of 2005 when he was a House page. After his return home to Louisiana, Foley e-mailed him and asked for a picture. That request was "sick" and "freaked me out," the boy said in an e-mail to a colleague in the office of Rep. Rodney Alexander, R-La., who had sponsored the boy in the House.

Harman was on "Fox News Sunday," while Bartlett and Murtha appeared on ABC's "This Week."

Why should we believe Hastert that the other emails were also only "over fiendly" when he has admitted to lying about when he knew about them? If they were only overfriendly, why did Foley resign in shame and appologize for "failing his friends and family and constituents"?

[ October 01, 2006, 02:07 PM: Message edited by: Liberal ]

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kenmeer livermaile
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Well, the bigger they come, the harder they fall. (included sexual double entendres not intended but not unwelcome).

And Hastert is one very big boy.

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The Drake
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Does anyone else think that this would have been addressed Sooner, if not for the certainty that political hay would be made of the fact that he was a Republican? Imagine a world where your representatives spend more time doing what needs to be done, than figuring out how to take political advantage of a bad situation.

Imagine the Concord Party.

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0Megabyte
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Which has about as much chance of becoming powerful at this point in time as does the FPE.

Which is not to say I don't hope that it will eventually become what you hope it will. And if I can be in a position to help make that happen, I'll do so.

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Liberal
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quote:
Originally posted by The Drake:
Does anyone else think that this would have been addressed Sooner, if not for the certainty that political hay would be made of the fact that he was a Republican? Imagine a world where your ;representatives spend more time doing what needs to be done, than figuring out how to take political advantage of a bad situation. Though lately with Abramof, Delay and other issues they have been acting cagey.

Imagine the Concord Party.

...

I am trying hard not to assume this is apologetic crap. There is no excuse at all for this, and the republicans haven't shied away before in certain other cases about exposing one of their own for corruption and rule breaking.

In any system with political parties there are "opportunities for making political hay." Certain parties are non-unique to this, and the only reason this is a problem for the overall gop at ALL right now is because they knew about it and didn't disclose it when they knew. If they had done so as soon as they found out I seriously doubt anyone would think it was a "republican issue" any more than that east coast governor who had a gay affair would have been a "democratic" issue (he was a dem right?)

[ October 01, 2006, 05:18 PM: Message edited by: Liberal ]

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FiredrakeRAGE
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Liberal -

New Jersey governors get their own category [Smile]

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Jesse
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Well, playing with Boys over 18 is just bad press if you're doing it behind your wife's back...and they work for you.

A little different than trashing the Library Congress by trying to bend over the Pages.

All of that being said, there isn't much in the way of "hay" here. I do believe the matter deserves serious investigation, and that we need to know what other members of the House knew and when they knew it.

If some Democratic Congress thingy from Florida got a call from a concerned parent or page and didn't act, I'll call for their resignation.

We just don't know enough to start sharpening up the guillotine, let alone roll it out, but the matter deserves investigation by the ethics committee, and not just investigation into the released e-mail.

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Tom Curtis
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The Drake:

quote:
Does anyone else think that this would have been addressed Sooner, if not for the certainty that political hay would be made of the fact that he was a Republican? Imagine a world where your representatives spend more time doing what needs to be done, than figuring out how to take political advantage of a bad situation.

Imagine the Concord Party.

So we are to imagine the Concord Party would not make political hay out of such situations, even though that is exactly what you have just done on its behalf?

Sorry, my imagination isn't that good.

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Tom Curtis
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Liberal, I think a call for resignation is to early. A call for a bipartisan or independant, open investigation which includes an invistigation of the GOP leadership responce seems in order.
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Liberal
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quote:
Originally posted by Tom Curtis:
Liberal, I think a call for resignation is to early. A call for a bipartisan or independant, open investigation which includes an invistigation of the GOP leadership responce seems in order.

Why too early? They already admitted lying about when they knew, lying about something this serious should be immediate grounds for resignation.

[ October 01, 2006, 10:17 PM: Message edited by: Liberal ]

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Tom Curtis
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The question is, why were they lying, and how much did they know.

Obviously they lied to avoid adverse political consequences, but did they do so while genuinely trying to investigate the offences, protect children from more offences, and ease Foley out of Congress (in other words, do the right thing but on the quiet); or did they lie to cover up that they did nothing? If the former, they certainly deserve a rebuke, but do not necessarilly need to resign. They may still, but it depends on how active their invetigation, and how rigourous the measures they took. If the later, they ought not only to resign, but if possible, be prosecuted as accessories to Foley's crime. (I assume it is a crime in the US. It certainly ought to be.)

I will concede that given the attempted impeachment of Clinton, they ought to resign on the basis of consistency.

But I thought it was a witch hunt to attempt Clinton's impeachment, so on the basis of consistency, I won't call for resignation on limited evidence. (I won't anyway, because its not by country, but you know what I mean.)

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The Drake
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quote:
Originally posted by Tom Curtis:
So we are to imagine the Concord Party would not make political hay out of such situations, even though that is exactly what you have just done on its behalf?

Sorry, my imagination isn't that good.

That's cute, I appreciate the irony. The difference between my hay and theirs, is that I'm describing a situation that's entrenched in the political system, not a peripheral event that happened with one member of Congress that hasn't even been investigated. Unless we believe that there was a conspiracy in the GOP to get this teenager's picture?

I agree with your assessment in your most recent post. When we know more, we can decide appropriately what to think and do about the situation.

Maybe the solution is a bipartisan training session - "How to avoid hitting on your pages and interns"

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The Drake
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If every politician who lied had to resign, they wouldn't be able to muster a quorum.
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DaveS
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But, it would set a new standard. Maybe it would lead to a higher class of pol. Or maybe to a higher level of obfuscation and misdirection. Since it's never been tried, we can't really know.
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Everard
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"If every politician who lied had to resign, they wouldn't be able to muster a quorum."

I think I've mentioned this before, but I'd love to see a constitutional amendment making all public statements by elected officials assumed to be under oath.

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kenmeer livermaile
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Yeah, but Foley lied about SEX. And you know what an impeachable offense THAT is.
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Kent
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I'm pleased to see that the Speaker has requested the Justice Department to do the investigation, rather than keeping it "in house" (pun intended). Link Here.
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Richard Dey
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Foley will blame the booze. He personally has no interest in the bodies of teenaged boys; the booze did. Only the Church Lady has the ballocks to admit that the devil made him do it [Wink] .

AoL immediately asks if this will hurt the Republicans in November.

Will this scandal hurt other Republicans on Election Day?
Yes 76%
No 24%
Total Votes: 28,221


FBI Examines Foley's E-Mails to Teen Boys
Former Congressman Seeks Treatment for Alcoholism
By LARA JAKES JORDAN, AP

WASHINGTON (Oct. 2) - While GOP leaders scramble to contain the political fallout from the latest Washington sex scandal, the FBI is examining Republican Rep. Mark Foley's e-mail exchanges with teenage boys and Foley announced he has checked himself into an alcohol rehabilitation facility.

The FBI "is conducting an assessment to see if there's been a violation of federal law," FBI spokesman Richard Kolko said, declining to elaborate.

Foley announced Monday through his attorney that he had been battling alcoholism and had checked into an unidentified rehabilitation facility for treatment over the weekend. "I strongly believe that I am an alcoholic and have accepted the need for immediate treatment for alcoholism and other behavioral problems," Foley said in a statement released in Florida by his attorney, David Roth.

"I deeply regret and accept full responsibility for the harm I have caused," Foley said in the statement.

Foley abruptly quit Congress on Friday after reports surfaced that he'd sent sexually charged electronic messages to boys working as congressional pages.

The disclosure sent House Republicans into damage control mode amid charges by Democrats that some House leaders may have known for months about Foley's inappropriate overtures toward the young pages.

House Speaker Dennis Hastert, R-Ill., in a letter sent Sunday to Attorney General Alberto Gonzales, asked the Justice Department to "conduct an investigation of Mr. Foley's conduct with current and former House pages."

Political Sex Scandals

White House counsel Dan Bartlett called the allegations involving Foley shocking, while Democrats demanded that investigators determine whether Republican leaders tried to cover up Foley's actions for political reasons.

"The attorney general should open a full-scale investigation immediately," Senate Democratic leader Harry Reid of Nevada said in a statement, including whether GOP leaders "knew there was a problem and ignored it to preserve a congressional seat this election year."

Foley's district is heavily Republican, but now may be won by a Democrat. Republicans are struggling to maintain their House majority in the upcoming election.

FBI cyber sleuths are looking into the text of some of the Foley messages, checking to see how many e-mails and instant electronic messages were sent and how many computers were used, according to a law enforcement official, who spoke on condition of anonymity because of the ongoing investigation.

The FBI also was trying to determine if any of the teenagers who received messages are willing to cooperate with the investigation, the official said.

Ironically, Foley, who is 52 and single, could be found to have violated a law that he helped to write as co-chairman of the Congressional Missing and Exploited Children's Caucus.

"Republican leaders have admitted to knowing about Mr.Foley's outrageous behavior for six months to a year, and they chose to cover it up rather than to protect these children," said House Democratic leader Nancy Pelosi of California.

Rep. Thomas Reynolds of New York, head of the House Republican election effort, said he told Hastert months ago about the allegations involving a 16-year-old boy from Louisiana.

Hastert acknowledged that his staff had been made aware of concerns about what they termed "over-friendly" e-mails Foley had sent to the teenager -- including one requesting his picture -- in the fall of 2005, and that they referred the matter to the House clerk.

But Hastert said those e-mails were not viewed as "sexual in nature" and that he was not aware of "a different set of communications which were sexually explicit ... which Mr. Foley reportedly sent another former page or pages."

From the Trail

Control of Congress is at stake. Keep up with all the news on the fall races.
· Full Coverage

More News: Senate | House | Governor | Road to 2008

Hastert asked the Justice Department to investigate "anyone who had specific knowledge of the content of any sexually explicit communications between Mr. Foley and any former or current House pages and what actions such individuals took, if any, to provide them to law enforcement."

A Pelosi spokeswoman, Jennifer Crider, late Sunday said that Hastert "seems more concerned by who revealed the Republican leadership coverup of Mr. Foley's Internet stalking of an underage child than he was about ensuring the children entrusted to the House were protected."

[NB: Are Pages 'children' [Embarrassed] ]

"We need to make sure that the page system is one in which children come up here and can work and make sure that they are protected," said Bartlett, the White House counsel, as he made the rounds of the Sunday morning talk shows.

Congressional pages, a staple of Washington politics since the 1820s, are high school students who serve as gofers in the House and Senate.

Republican leaders say it's their duty to ensure House pages' safety, and they're setting up a toll-free hot line for pages and their families to call to confidentially report any incidents. They also will consider adopting new rules on communications between lawmakers and pages.

Rep. Jane Harman of California, top Democrat on the House Intelligence Committee, said Democrats should have been told about concerns over Foley's conduct. "I gather that basically nothing was done except that Foley was warned," she said on Fox News Sunday.

"It really makes me nervous that they might have tried to cover this up," said Rep. John Murtha, D-Pa., on ABC's "This Week," adding that already "the reputation of Congress under the Republican leadership is lower than used car salesmen."

AP reporter John Heilprin contributed to this story.

10/2/2006 09:07:21

Here, if they come through, is the text of the emails:

http://abcnews.go.com/WNT/BrianRoss/story?id=2509586

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Richard Dey
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NB:

Let's remain calm and 'cool' on this and use the sophisticated terminology that kids use today, Liberal -- before you alienate my plot to vote Democrat this November [Wink] . This is ephebophilia, not pederasty.

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kenmeer livermaile
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"Rep. Thomas Reynolds of New York, head of the House Republican election effort, said he told Hastert months ago about the allegations involving a 16-year-old boy from Louisiana."

Turning on their own. Anyone strongly associated with the White House is fair game. The White House of the past 6 years has demanded lock-step behavior from the Republican political establshment. GUys like Hastert and Delay were crucial to enforcing this. Delay's down. Guyess who's next?

Trent Lott is finding this hilarious, I'm sure.

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DaveS
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In Hastert's defense, he had the information, but he just didn't see these revelations coming. Heck, nobody could have predicted it. I find it totally ironic and weird that a mess involving one Republican Congressman's peccadillos and his party's high-handed stance on "family values" will overshadow the Iraq war mess to be the reason the Goppers are dead in this election.
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kenmeer livermaile
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"In Hastert's defense, he had the information, but he just didn't see these revelations coming."

I'm not sure what you're defending here on Hastert's part. Could you clarify? When Monica was happening, many on the left were amused that Clinton wasn't getting hammered for the 1995 telecomm act (a bill that tried to pass provisions that made the current wiretap invasion seem bening) or Nafta or industrial outsourcing or... instead it was a pretty plump girl whith great hazoongeez and gorgeopus bruentte hair.

We proceed from dress stains to soiled pages.

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DaveS
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quote:
I'm not sure what you're defending here on Hastert's part.
Nothing. So far this Administration has used the Nobody-Could-Have defense at least three times to avoid accountability; I was just offering it to Hastert in case he reads this forum. Sorry, I should have used the special sarcasm font so that no Ornery folks were misled.
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kenmeer livermaile
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"White House spokesman Tony Snow on Monday attempted to deflect the political repercussions of the Foley exchanges with pages, saying, "The House has to clean up the mess, to the extent there is a mess."

"This does not affect every Republican in the United States of America, just as bad behavior on Democrats' part is not a reflection on the entire party," Snow added. "


Things must be pretty bad if the White House spokesperson resorts to fair and reasoned statements.

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LoverOfJoy
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Does anyone have a link to how exactly this came out (as far as has been made public anyway). I haven't been keeping up on the news and everything I've read seems to jump to the latest instead of how this all got started.

My understanding from what I've read is that Foley was having some "questionable" communications with boys and then Reynolds somehow found out and notified Hastert some months ago. How did he find out? Did the boy report Foley to someone? The article Liberal posted mentions:

quote:
Hastert later acknowledged that aides referred the matter to the authorities last fall.
Authorities meaning what? FBI? Some cops? If some boy made some wild accusation I definitely wouldn't shrug it off but I'm not sure I'd be making public statements about it, either. I'd report it to the authorities, for sure. If the authorities investigated it and couldn't find enough evidence for it to hold water, I'd hope that I didn't hold it forever against the accused, although I might be a bit more careful and watchful in the future.

This should definitely be investigated. Reading the instant messenger transcript made it obvious that what was going on was inappropriate. I'm not sure if the first emails or word that Hastert found out about 10 months ago was anywhere near that magnitude of indiscretion. Maybe the original ones seen really did just seem, "overfriendly." I don't know. But then I don't even know what happened to make all this come out now.

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RickyB
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The page who was on the receiving side of some of Foley's messages reported to Rep. Reynolds, who was his sponsor, and Reynolds reported to Hastert.
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Daruma28
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What the hell are you Liberals talking about? The GOP leadership was merely protecting a poor, oppressed sexually confused person who merely has an alternative lifestyle!

They should be COMMMENDED and LAUDED for standing up to the homophobic, bigoted and intolerant witch hunt carried out by the SUPPOSEDLY "liberal" open-minded, accepting and tolerant Democrats!!!!

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Jesse
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Daruma, sell it to NAMBLA.

I hear the North American Marlon Brando Look-Alikes love that kind of argument [Smile]

If he'd been hitting on college interns over 18, do you think anyone would be adressing this as anything but basic garden varity sexual harrasment?

The vast, overwhelming majority of us "liberals" are pretty solidly on the record against grown ups humping or trying to hump folks under 18.

If all Hastert had seen was the publicly released messages asking for a picture, how old the page was, and so on ... with no clear sexual context ... I think he acted appropriatly.

If it turns out he saw more clearly incriminating messages, I'll have a very different position.

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Wayward Son
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I know, Daruma. It's kind of refreshing to see Republicans defending out-of-the-mainstream minorities, rather than their usual defense of the financially corrupt and of the President's lies. There is hope for them yet! [Big Grin] [Razz]
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Daruma28
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Well....hey, isn't the most relevant point of debate here what the actual legal age of consent is in D.C.?

Because if it's similar to what we have here in Hawaii (14) or like most other places (16) I don't see how the party of "it was a private affair between two consenting adults" has any grounds for the current scandal mongering.


BTW - for the record, yes of course I was being faceitious.

All the bums should be thrown out...but it most certainly would not be some kind of upgrade to put the Democrats back in power either.

Vote Libertarian. [Big Grin]

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Jesse
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"BTW - for the record, yes of course I was being faceitious."

I know, that's why I threw in the smile.

Daruma, age of consent in florida is 18. The weird thing is, in many jurisdictions where the age of consent is 16, an adult can still be charge with corrupting a minor for messing about with them.

Even wierder...the age of consent is 18 for all Americans traveling abroad.

All of that being said, a lower age of consent doesn't equal a lower age of majority, so the argument that Foley was sexually harasing minors still holds water.

I have no idea how the crossing state lines thing works. The age of consent in the State the message is placed from, or the age of consent in the State where the minor recieved it?

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RickyB
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Um, also, there are workplace issues involved. I've never been a congressional page, but I'm pretty sure they don't feel free to tell a congressman who's creeping them out to **** off.
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Daruma28
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You guys know what GOP stands for now?

Gay Old Pedophiles

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kenmeer livermaile
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Formerly known as Garrulous Old Porkers.
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LoverOfJoy
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quote:
The page who was on the receiving side of some of Foley's messages reported to Rep. Reynolds, who was his sponsor, and Reynolds reported to Hastert.
Are you talking about just now or ten months ago. It seems like some information came out ten months ago but never went public. Then something's come out just now that's gone public. If a page complained to his sponsor ten months ago and all that was done was Reynolds told Hastert who then told Foley to back off, I find that wholly inadequate.
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Jesse
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Nobody even snickered at my page bending quip [Frown]
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Jesse
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LoJ

That all depends on what the page said to Reynolds, and what Reynolds said to Hastert.

If the page complained that Foley was "creepy" the response was appropriate.

If the page complained that Foley asked to see his naughty bits, we have a problem.

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Daruma28
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LMAO...you actually made me re-read the thread to find it.

"A little different than trashing the Library Congress by trying to bend over the Pages."

ha ha ha! That was punny! [Smile]

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LoverOfJoy
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quote:
LoJ

That all depends on what the page said to Reynolds, and what Reynolds said to Hastert.

If the page complained that Foley was "creepy" the response was appropriate.

If the page complained that Foley asked to see his naughty bits, we have a problem.

That's a good point. Even then, I'd hope Reynolds and possibly Hastert to follow up a bit in probing what the boy meant by creepy. I've been a TA before and if a student came to me and said they met with the professor and came to me because the professor creeped them out I would probably assume it was just a personality conflict but I'd still ask what happened to make him/her feel that way. If it sounded fairly innocuous I might just explain to the student that he probably just meant X and to not let it get to them. If it sounded worse I'd definitely do more about it. Even TAs are trained about harrassment and the like and know they can't let things like that pass...if it sounds even close to harrassment you act on the safe side. It may come to nothing but you don't just shrug it off.
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Adam Masterman
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GOP still stands for what it has always stood for...

(wait for it)

Guardians Of Privilege

*nods to Harry Truman*

Adam

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