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Author Topic: Wonderful news for those who fear a "President Rudy"
RickyB
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Link

And this is the man that Rude-boi wanted to have appointed in charge of homeland security. The man he did indeed appoint in charge of New York City security. I have nothing but utter contempt for anyone who knows the facts and continues to claim with a straight face that they're voting for citizen Giuliani because of terrorism or national security.

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DaveS
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quote:
Former Mayor Rudolph W. Giuliani said yesterday that the crime-fighting successes of the disgraced former police commissioner, Bernard B. Kerik, outweighed his legal problems, and added that “if I have the same degree of success and failure as president of the United States, this country will be in great shape.”
He failed to go on to say "Anyway, how can he be a crook, he's in government! After all, 9/11!"
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Lobo
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Guilt by association then?
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RickyB
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Guilt by endorsement, not association. It's not just "he's buddies with the guy". It's "he appointed him to one job he was unqualified for, and pushed him for an even higher one". That's association?

If you endorse a crook, yes, you are guilty of endorsing crooks for high and important office. I'm not even gonna go into the fact that Rudy and Bernie are pretty damn close, or that Bernie is a partner in Giuliani's consulting firm. It's not like "he barely knew the man".

Please, is this was a Dem yo'd be all over it as proof how Dems can't be trusted with national security.

And once again, I refer you to wight years of not changing the comm gear that malfunctioned in WTC 93, and to the egomaniacla, pampered, spoiled-rotten insistence on placing the command center in the WTC. That's guilt by association too?

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kenmeer livermaile
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Bernie doesn't deserve the credit. That's shyte. Credit goes to William Bratton
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RickyB
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Credit for what? NYC's reduction in crime? Of course that's Bratton. Who said otherwise?
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The Drake
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If we're going to rule out candidates based on their close associates being indicted, don't we have to throw out Hillary as well?
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Everard
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Who did hillary apoint to a key position (key in relation to her constituency, and key to her campaign for president) that was indicted for how he acted while in the office hillary appointed him to?
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RickyB
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Exactly, Ev. This goes directly to competence, suitability, what have you. To suitability. If Rudy were president two years ago, Kerik WOULD have been appointed, or at least nominated, to the DHS. How is there a single person who cares about America whom that does NOT bother?

Speaking of Rudy, how does anyone even contemplating voting for him feel about him accepting the endorsement of someone who, as recently as 2005, was saying that 9-11 was divine judgment on America?

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The Drake
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http://www.wnbc.com/politics/4063107/detail.html
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RickyB
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Wow, fund-raising offenses vs. mob ties for a police chief. campaign finance director vs. police chief/DHS sec. I'd score one a 2 and the other a 9, with a threshold of 5 for disqualification.
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The Drake
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Our country has a fine tradition of electing mobsters, racketeers, and bootleggers, Ricky. [Smile]
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DaveS
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For some reason (fatigue?) I first read your post as citing monsters, rabbitears and bootlickers. Not sure what rabbitears are, but that list is also valid.
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flydye45
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"Who did hillary apoint to a key position (key in relation to her constituency, and key to her campaign for president) that was indicted for how he acted while in the office hillary appointed him to? "

I love the Jesuital phrasing "Hillary appointed to?".

Short list

Sandy Berger (current advisor)

Craig Livingstone (Hillary appointee)


quote:
On several occasions, Berger stuffed highly classified documents into his pants and socks before spiriting them out of the Archives building in Washington, according to investigators. On one occasion, upon reaching the street, he hid documents under a construction trailer after checking the windows of the Archives and Justice Department buildings to make sure he was not being watched.

Berger came back later and retrieved the documents, taking them home and cutting them up with scissors. Two days later, he was informed by Archive employees that his removal of documents had been detected.

“Berger panicked because he realized he was caught,” said a report by the National Archives inspector general, which also recounted his initial reaction. “Berger lied.”

Berger also lied to the public, telling reporters he made an “honest mistake” by “inadvertently” taking the documents, which he blamed on his own “sloppiness.” Bill Clinton vouched for the explanation for Berger, who served as his national security adviser.

Berger later conceded: “I was giving a benign explanation for what was not benign.”

The Justice Department initially said Berger stole only copies of classified documents and not originals. But the House Government Reform Committee later revealed that an unsupervised Berger had been given access to classified files of original, uncopied, uninventoried documents on terrorism. Several Archives officials acknowledged that Berger could have stolen any number of items and they “would never know what, if any, original documents were missing.”

At his sentencing in September 2005, Berger was fined $50,000, placed on probation for two years and stripped of his security clearance for three years.

Source: DC Examiner


Carry on.

[ November 08, 2007, 11:16 PM: Message edited by: flydye45 ]

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RickyB
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Berger is bad, but an advisor is not an executive position. Livingstone was fired and, from Wiki:

quote:
he matter was investigated by the Whitewater Independent Counsel, who found in 2000 that there was no criminal activity by anyone in the matter,[7] and that there was no credible evidence that senior White House figures or the First Lady had requested the files or had acted improperly or testified improperly regarding Livingstone's hiring.[7]
After 50 million dollars, we can put Mr. Livingstone behind Mrs. Clinton, I presume.

If Clinton gives Berger any kind of post with access to sensitive material, I'll agree that it's very close to the severity of appointing a Kerik.

Drake - don't we elect their sons? [Razz]

[ November 09, 2007, 12:27 AM: Message edited by: RickyB ]

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DaveS
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Rudy was asked yesterday if he would pardon Bernie if he were elected. His answer was:
quote:
"He may or may not be charged, he may or may not be convicted. Who knows what happens?"
One more reason to hope he is the Gopper candidate.
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RickyB
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Hmmmmm. Sorta like his position on Iraq...
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TheSteelenGeneral
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Make no mistake Rudy will be the next president. First Italian! The hatred for Hillary will outweigh anything socially liberal position he might have.
About Rudy, David Cross had some amusing things to say about him, skip to 1:20 for the good stuff.

Also enlightening: Republican Party Values

Americans voted consistently against their own best interest, why should this one be any different?

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RickyB
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I dunno. Are Americans ready for a first lady who used to kill puppies on stage for a living, and who reserves an airplane seat for her handbag? [Big Grin]
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Lobo
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quote:
Originally posted by RickyB:
I dunno. Are Americans ready for a first lady who used to kill puppies on stage for a living, and who reserves an airplane seat for her handbag? [Big Grin]

Give me a frickin break Ricky. Rudy will have a new wife by then...
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flydye45
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quote:
he matter was investigated by the Whitewater Independent Counsel, who found in 2000 that there was no criminal activity by anyone in the matter,[7] and that there was no credible evidence that senior White House figures or the First Lady had requested the files or had acted improperly or testified improperly regarding Livingstone's hiring.[7]
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

After 50 million dollars, we can put Mr. Livingstone behind Mrs. Clinton, I presume

Wow! Was the whole 50 Million paid for just the one investigation? What a rip off! [Wink]

Ricky, I was using the "Plame" standard of culpability. If you exchange Bush for Hillary and Cheney for Livingston, you get similar results. Has the Left dropped that particular bone? I think not...

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Boy Logic
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quote:
Originally posted by RickyB:
Wow, fund-raising offenses vs. mob ties for a police chief. campaign finance director vs. police chief/DHS sec. I'd score one a 2 and the other a 9, with a threshold of 5 for disqualification.

And anyways, who in MA of RI do you know of in politics that doesn't have mob ties?
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Everard
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Umm, just about all the people I know in MA politics don't have mob ties... and thats a large double digit number, thanks.

[ November 14, 2007, 03:54 PM: Message edited by: Everard ]

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TheSteelenGeneral
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Americans, or maybe just Republicans, seem to have this amazing ability to forgive republican politicians for their criminal or immoral behavior, something which they don't seem to do for Democrats.

Cases in point: David Vetter and Larry Craig.
Initially only David Vetter was quickly forgiven for his visiting hookers, despite the incredible hypocrisy of that, seeing as how he is a "Family Values" campaigner. Rep leadership more or less swept it under the mat, allowed so by an indifferent audience. Rep media explained it by his addmittance to his faults, leftwing media said it was because he wasn't gay.

But now, even Larry Craig has managed to keep his money and is staying on until 2008 at least, by just playing dumb and refusing to step down. No doubt fux nuws will make a sorta hero of him, describing him as "standing his ground" and "sticking to his guns" and more BS like that ...

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Daruma28
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quote:
Americans, or maybe just Republicans, seem to have this amazing ability to forgive republican politicians for their criminal or immoral behavior, something which they don't seem to do for Democrats.
It's so funny to see Democrat supporters make this claim...when one can easily find Republicans that make the exact same claim...

...and that both sides have valid examples to back it up!

[LOL]

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TheSteelenGeneral
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Care to back that up?
This list of Republicans is rather compelling, do you have a similar list for Democrats, for the same time frame? And not all parking tickets ... [Wink] Btw the music is kinda nice too.

01. VPCoS Scooter Libby: CONVICTED Obstruction of Justice / Making false statements
02. Gov. Bob Taft: CONVICTED FOUR [4] first degree ethics violations.
03. Gov. John Rowland : CONVICTED Conspiracy to steal Honest service
04. Gov. George Ryan: CONVICTED Racketeering Conspiracy / Making False Statements / Mail Fraud Tax Evasion
05. Lob. Jack Abramoff: CONVICTED Fraud / Tax Evasion / Conspiracy to Bribe Public officials
06. Sen. Larry Craig: CONVICTED Lewd Conduct / Solicitation / Making false statements
07. Rep. Bob Ney: CONVICTED Conspiracy / Making False Statements
08. Rep. Duke Vunningham: CONVICTED Conspiracy to commit Bribery
09. Rep. Bill Janklow.: CONVICTED Manslaughter / Reckless Driving / Running a stop sign / Speeding.

10. Gov. Ernie Fletchter: INDICTED Conspiracy / Official misconduct / Political Discrimination.
11. Rep. Thomas Ravenal: INDICTED Feloney possesson of COKE w/intent 2 distri.
12. Rep. Tom Delay: INDICTED Money laundering / Conspiracy to commit money laundering & to commit election fraud

13 R. Limbo CHARGED conscription drug fraud
14 B. O'Reilly CHARGED Sex harassment
15 Ann Coulter INVESTIGATED Voter fraud
16 Rep. Mark Foley INVESTIGATED/RESIGNED lewd conduct towards minors
17 Rep. Don Sherwood PROSECUTED attempted strangulation (his mistress)

UNDER CRIMINAL INVESTIGATION
18. Sen. Ted Stevens
19. Sen Peter Dominici
20. Rep Dennis Hastert
21. Rep Don Young
22. Gov Jim Gibbons
23. Rep. Tom Feeney
24. Rep. Rick Renzi
[i]25. Rep. John Doolittle

26. Jerry Lewis
27. Rep. Tim Murphy
28. Rep. Gary Miller

[ November 15, 2007, 11:01 PM: Message edited by: TheSteelenGeneral ]

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TheSteelenGeneral
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Also
http://blogs.tnr.com/tnr/blogs/the_stump/archive/2007/11/14/things-you-don-t-want-to-read-if-you-re-a-giuliani-donor.aspx

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The Drake
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Well, a quick google search finds:

Rep. Filner (CA) - assault and battery
Rep. Jefferson (LA) - racketeering, money laundering, soliciting bribes
Rep. Briley (state leg.) - DUI, felony evasion, high speed chase

I don't intend to compile a whole montage, since I don't really hate Democrats enough to make a movie about the bad ones.

edited to add: I don't actually hate Democrats at all, never mind enough to make a movie about them.

[ November 16, 2007, 11:45 AM: Message edited by: The Drake ]

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flydye45
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Don't forget Mayor McGreevey, who resigned, not because he was a proud gay American, but because he was guilty of nepotism, and had investigations which were quickly gaining ground on an indictment.

Eliot Spitzer is now the target of some investigations regarding his use of personnel. Expect indictments soon.

Gerry Studds in the Congressional Page Sex Scandal

John Murtha Abscam and some more recent allegations

Any Kennedy, though Teddy pleaded guilty of walking away from a drowning woman.

Harry Reid

Jim McDermott, Guilty of illegal wiretapping
Link to a site probably as biased as yours except in the other direction.

Instapundit has a theory about articles on illegal activity. If it's a Republican, there is an (R) right next to the name. Strangely, most media keyboards lack the (D) key...at least when similar articles are made in the other direction.

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The Drake
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"Corrupt politicians make the other ten percent look bad."
–Henry A. Kissinger

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