This is topic Republican Widow Corroborates Bush going AWOL in forum General Comments at The Ornery American Forum.


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Posted by David Ricardo (Member # 1678) on :
 
Since everyone seems to be having fun with discussing past military records, it's time to take a look at some new information about how Bush went AWOL in the National Guard.

We have something new, and this from Linda Allison, the widow of Jimmy Allison. Jimmy Allison was a newspaper owner and campaign consultant from Midland, Texas. He was a Bush family political guru before anyone heard of Karl Rove or Lee Atwater. Oh. And Jimmy also found a place on an Alabama senate campaign he was managing for a "troublesome eldest son," the 25 year-old G.W. Bush -- because Bush the Elder asked him to.

Here is the link: http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2004/09/02/allison/index_np.html

The story goes like this:

quote:
"The impression I had was that Georgie was raising a lot of hell in Houston, getting in trouble and embarrassing the family, and they just really wanted to get him out of Houston and under Jimmy's wing," Allison's widow, Linda, told me. "And Jimmy said, 'Sure.' He was so loyal."

Linda Allison's story, never before published, contradicts the Bush campaign's assertion that George W. Bush transferred from the Texas Air National Guard to the Alabama National Guard in 1972 because he received an irresistible offer to gain high-level experience on the campaign of Bush family friend Winton "Red" Blount. In fact, according to what Allison says her late husband told her, the younger Bush had become a political liability for his father, who was then the United States ambassador to the United Nations, and the family wanted him out of Texas. "I think they wanted someone they trusted to keep an eye on him," Linda Allison said.

[...]

Allison's account corroborates a Washington Post investigation in February that found no credible witnesses to the service in the Alabama National Guard that Bush maintains he performed, despite a lack of documentary evidence. Asked if she'd ever seen Bush in a uniform, Allison said: "Good lord, no. I had no idea that the National Guard was involved in his life in any way." Allison also confirmed previously published accounts that Bush often showed up in the Blount campaign offices around noon, boasting about how much alcohol he had consumed the night before. (Bush has admitted that he was a heavy drinker in those years, but he has refused to say whether he also used drugs).

Some of the most telling parts of the article are anecdotes relating to the trashy character of the boorish George W. Bush:

quote:
The break happened not long after a boozy election-night wake for Blount, who lost his Senate bid to the incumbent Democrat, John Sparkman. Leaving the election-night "celebration," Allison remembers encountering George W. Bush in the parking lot, urinating on a car, and hearing later about how he'd yelled obscenities at police officers that night. Bush left a house he'd rented in Montgomery trashed -- the furniture broken, walls damaged and a chandelier destroyed, the Birmingham News reported in February. "He was just a rich kid who had no respect for other people's possessions," Mary Smith, a member of the family who rented the house, told the newspaper, adding that a bill sent to Bush for repairs was never paid. And a month later, in December, during a visit to his parents' home in Washington, Bush drunkenly challenged his father to go "mano a mano," as has often been reported.
There you have it. On the one hand, you have a man who is being questioned for taking shrapnel in his posterior under fire from Viet Cong guerillas in the Vietnam War. On the other hand, you have a no-good rich kid brat with two silver spoons in his mouth who was far too busy urinating on cars, drunkenly yelling at police officers, and refusing to pay for rented houses that he vandalized -- to bother fulfilling his required service in the National Guard after his father pulled strings with Texas Lieut. Gov. Ben Barnes to give W. a draft-dodging spot in the National Guard, thereby going AWOL in favor of his drunken hedonistic lifestyle.

It gives you a little insight into why George W. Bush seems to use and abuse the great United States like his old fraternity house upon which he would urinate during those long drunken booze-fests while he was dodging the draft in the Vietnam War.

[ September 02, 2004, 07:19 AM: Message edited by: David Ricardo ]
 
Posted by ATW (Member # 1690) on :
 
Gee, yeah, there you have it.

At the time the widow and her husband according to the article lived in Midland, Texas says that she knew what was happening with Bush who lived 600 miles away in Houston.

Then when he moved an extra 600 miles away to Alabama, she knew even more about him.

Lurid details like Bush didn't wear his National Guard uniform when he was working at his regular job. All the Guard people I know wear their uniforms 24 hours a day 365 days a year which is how the Guard has earned the nickname of "weekend warriors".

Also revealed that back when Bush used to be a drunk that he acted like a drunk.

My, my, how will the Bush campain survive this scandal?

Not to mention the credibility of a source which has repeatedly run itself to the brink of bankruptcy repeatedly due to embracing the idea that it can stay afloat by writing hit pieces on Bush.

==

How does this contradict anything in Bush's official story?

Bush says he received an irresistable offer of employment. The article says he received an irresistable offer of employment because his family was worried about him and arranged it.

Supposedly the article has something to do with Bush's national guard service but the lady being interviewed wasn't aware he was in the guard. How is she testifying to something that she admits she knows nothing about?

She wasn't stuck to him 24 hours a day and guard service isn't very time consuming. Bush wasn't in any way required to report his activities to the wife of one of his dad's friends.

Judging from her tone, she didn't approve of him much at all so I don't find it remarkable that she didn't take the time to become aware of what he did outside the office.

If there's some aspect of the story I missed, I'd be glad to discuss it.
 
Posted by Ivan (Member # 1467) on :
 
So 30 years ago, Bush was a drunk and an irresponsible kid? I thought that was pretty common knowledge. Anyhow, he seems to have turned it around (he doesn't drink any more IIRC?) and he doesn't seem to want to go a round with his father anymore. This woman doesn't know about the AFNG, so that angle is pretty irrelevant.

Anyhow, if you can show that he urinated on a car this century, we'll talk....

-Ivan
 
Posted by David Ricardo (Member # 1678) on :
 
ATW, if you bothered to read the article, she saw him all the time in Alabama because George W. Bush was taken on as a political aide for her husband (who was a major Republican political strategist running an important campaign in Alabama).

In fact, her husband was supposed to make sure that George W. Bush stayed out of trouble by taking W. under his political wing.
 
Posted by WmLambert (Member # 604) on :
 
David, you are blowing so much smoke. Bush did serve his time - and if he didn't no one would have cared back then - and he would have been encouraged not to show. I wish you understood the times. We were pulling out of Vietnam. Congress had cut funds and Nixon didn't have enough money to bring the troops still there home. The military was stealing from one hand to pay the other. We were desparate to leave our allies with enough ammo and materiel to survive the impending bloodbath that Kerry claimed would never happen. But it did.

The entire military was ramping down trying to minimize costs. If you can find paperwork at all from that period that showed who was where and what they were doing, then you are beyond the norm.

However, we do have the paperwork on Bush that proves he fulfilled his time requirements. As with everyone else at the time - there were undocumented periods where he may have skipped a meeting or two, which was allowed, but enough overall documentation to prove he was over the time-served requirements.

Kerry, on the otherhand, did not just leave the Navy when he returned home after his disputed Purple Hearts, he was enlisted into the Naval Reserve where he was required to maintain his service. His documentation shows He was AWOL. The entire attack on Bush is the pot calling the kettle black. As a matter of fact. There is a period in question when Kerry is desparate to prove he was not serving anymore, because there are FBI records that put him at meetings in Paris with North Vietnamese Communist negotiators, and the Military Code of Justice forbids him from doing so. The punishment is serious prison time. He can't have it both ways. Either he was AWOL - or he was illegally meeting with the enemy during time of war.

You pick. He's your guy.

[ September 02, 2004, 10:36 AM: Message edited by: WmLambert ]
 
Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 99) on :
 
"So 30 years ago, Bush was a drunk and an irresponsible kid?"

Bush was a kid 30 years ago?
 
Posted by Star Pilot 111 (Member # 1972) on :
 
Ivan

Look at Kerry.
Anyhow, he seems to have turned it around (he doesn't put shrapnel in his butt anymore?) and he doesn't seem to want to.
 
Posted by Pete at Home (Member # 429) on :
 
quote:
Since everyone seems to be having fun with discussing past military records,
Sorry, David, I can't let you get away with that. You are the one who started posting this sort of thread here, bashing questionable accounts of past military records. You have no right to pretend that you're just joining in on this game -- you helped to start it. It's precisely because of those like you that this sort of thread is now acceptable fare. You dug a grave for Kerry by turning the election into this sort of game.

We are voting for Bush because of what he's done for the last 4 years. Not for what he did 40 years ago. Bush never made his behavior 40 years ago the central matter of his campaign.

Some irresponsible kids, like Henry V and George W. Bush, mature and become great leaders once the mantle of great power falls on them. And some good people, like John Kerry, cannot handle federal power without embarrassing themselves. Is it a coincidence that Kerry is burying his 20 years in the senate as if it were some national secret?
 
Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 99) on :
 
"We are voting for Bush because of what he's done for the last 4 years."

Why did you vote for Bush four years ago, then? Frankly, I think you're voting for Bush because you don't want to support the Democratic establishment.

[ September 02, 2004, 03:48 PM: Message edited by: TomDavidson ]
 


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