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Messages - yossarian22c

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101
General Comments / Re: Cryptocurrencies
« on: May 18, 2022, 03:38:45 PM »
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The entire market is based on speculator sentiment, so if you can affect speculator sentiment in an advantageous way that is literally you making a 'real effect' in its 'real value'.

And the market for years of Tesla wasn't?  The company had billion dollar valuations when it was producing hundreds of cars (total in a year).  Facebook had billions in valuation when its revenue stream was tiny.  Granted, there was a lot of potential there, but you're kidding yourself if you discount the potential that's currently in the crypto space.
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Tesla had an electric car design that was years beyond any of the major auto companies. Facebook had hundreds of millions of daily users. Crypto has hype and only hype.

At times Tesla and Facebook were probably overvalued on a rational basis (Tesla probably still is). But they had real assets, real value, and a real business plan. Crypto again has hype and some obscure mathematics. Is it possible for that hype to maintain value, possibly. Maybe they can convince some country with a crumbling currency to adopt crypto as a currency. But until crypto gets currency status somewhere its just trading electronic bits on a block chain and hoping that someone in the future will pay you more for those bits on the block chain.

102
General Comments / Re: Cryptocurrencies
« on: May 18, 2022, 03:17:21 PM »
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What they may tell you is "guaranteed returns!" which is the actual thing that would be illegal if it was translated into regulated securities, since it would be an illegal ponzi scheme. So I personally view the malfeasance, if any, to be on the side of those distributing the coins, not those who mess around with them.

It's only a ponzi scheme if it's not generating value and the primary source of returns is from new contributors.  The primary source of returns on digital assets is not from the redistribution of new contributions, but from the speculative swelling in the price.

The speculative swelling in price comes from new contributors. When the market/confidence goes away its worthless. So if new people quit contributing, the value/returns evaporate. Pretty close to a ponzi scheme. Not illegal because its pretty clear what people are buying so its not fraudulent the way a ponzi scheme is, but it can crash in exactly the same way. There is no value created by creating a bit coin. So the minute people quit buying in the value evaporates and the crypto currency collapses.

103
General Comments / Re: Cryptocurrencies
« on: May 18, 2022, 12:30:00 PM »
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What your grasping at is that value is still vapor-like.  While crypto is different than any other currencies, you can still ask yourself why people accept dollars in exchange for real goods.  It's not because the dollar itself has a value, its because of a long confidence that the dollar means something.  Is it really different if its a government that represents 300m people that says it has value, or 300 million people not represented by a government that say something has value?
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Taxes. Taxes make dollars valuable. Everyone has to pay taxes, property, income, etc. Therefore dollars are a needed commodity for people and businesses. So yes, dollars are valuable and maintain a relatively stable value because a government backed by 300 million people says they are valuable and everyone needs to obtain some to participate in the economy. Most crypto is just the solution to some math problem that literally no one cares about. Crypto farming has real costs, huge amounts of electricity used on the server farms. But you are right that the only thing that gives any crypto value is that people think it has some value. Therefore it can all drop to zero tomorrow. Crypto's appeal has been deregulation/decentralization of currency. However because it lacks that fundamental aspect of being the accepted tender by governments no business or individual needs to acquire bitcoin, tera coin, etc. Thus each individual currency has only the value that the confidence it inspires. If you thought runs on banks were bad before the FDIC when they had deposits that were backed by local home and business loans. Just think what a run on crypto looks like. There is nothing behind those currencies besides some abstract mathematics. I'm actually surprised it took this long for some financial institution, hedge fund, trader, North Korean hackers, or other entity to figure out how to make money crashing one of these. Maybe they are just now getting enough money involved to attract the big sharks and for there to be mechanisms to "short" the currency. My advice would be to get out of crypto, particularly any that attracts enough attention that shorting can be achieved. If you can make money off of crashing something that's value is 100% speculation and the confidence of people trading it then it won't take too long for the sharks to figure out how to short it and crater its value.

104
General Comments / Re: Election Results
« on: May 18, 2022, 12:09:07 PM »
https://www.npr.org/2022/05/17/1098787088/a-pro-trump-film-suggests-its-data-are-so-accurate-it-solved-a-murder-thats-fals

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Trump's official spokesperson, Liz Harrington, said True The Vote "solved a murder of a young little girl in Atlanta. I mean, they are heroes." Fans of the film have echoed that message on social media.

That claim is false.

Authorities in Georgia arrested and secured indictments against two suspects in the murder of Secoriea Turner in August 2021.

In response to NPR's inquiries, True The Vote acknowledged it had contacted law enforcement more than two months later, meaning it played no role in those arrests or indictments.

Amazing they were able to tip off law enforcement to an arrest they had already made.

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"The GBI did not receive information from True the Vote that connected to the Secoriea Turner investigation," said Nelly Miles, the GBI's Director of the Office of Public and Governmental Affairs.

An attorney for Secoriea Turner's family told NPR they had never heard of Engelbrecht's and Phillips' analysis either.

Also seems like they forgot to tip the police off to the arrest they made months earlier.

But onto the main claim about mules.

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True The Vote said it used the data to track the movements of people in key swing states around the time of the 2020 election. D'Souza, Engelbrecht and Phillips claim this location-tracking data show thousands of people making suspiciously large numbers of stops at mail-in vote dropboxes in the 2020 election. They allege those individuals, the "mules" of the title, were making multiple stops because they were actually stuffing the dropboxes with stacks of completed ballots - a practice that critics call "ballot harvesting."

The film also features video surveillance footage of some ballot dropboxes. But, as D'Souza himself has acknowledged, the film does not show any person on camera going to multiple dropboxes. So the film primarily relies on their claims about geotracking data, which D'Souza has argued are "more reliable than video footage."

So with all their "mules," data, and video they failed to identify the same person going to multiple drop boxes even once.

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Georgia Secretary of State Brad Raffensberger, a Republican, said his office had already examined one instance flagged by True The Vote, in which a man delivered multiple ballots to a dropbox. Raffensberger said they found no wrongdoing. "We investigated, and the five ballots that he turned in were all for himself and his family members," said Raffensperger.


And when their claims are investigated, no wrong doing.

I'm shocked, shocked, that putting out a for profit film ends up being hollow and devoid of fact. Just another right wing graft on the Trump cult.


105
General Comments / Re: Madison Cawthorn, Too Stupid to Serve?
« on: May 18, 2022, 11:48:33 AM »
Voters in the Republican primary seem to have decided (barely) that Madison Cawthorn is too stupid to serve.

106
General Comments / Re: Campaign Finance
« on: May 17, 2022, 02:16:51 PM »
That would be quite the coincidence.  Of course it would be completely irrelevant as the lobbyist is still subject to the cap of $2900 per election cycle. 
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I bet that coincidence happens in the next election cycle. Assuming we can learn about it. The SC may remove many financial disclosures. Or allow groups that don't have financial disclosures to donate to candidates. Wealthy guy A can donate $2900, and all the 501c3 he donates to anonymously can give another $2900. And if you are like postmaster general Louis DeJoy you can direct and give bonuses to your employees to give money to the right candidates. Hey its against the law, but if his profile hadn't been raised quite so high and hadn't given up direct control of his companies maybe no one ever decides to speak out. At will employment makes ratting on the boss a dicey proposition. And the difference between pre and post election is that giving after the election means you are giving money essentially directly to the candidate (to repay their loans) to someone who has already won the election. Its like spending your campaign dollars on a sure bet.

107
General Comments / Campaign Finance
« on: May 17, 2022, 01:00:56 PM »
https://www.npr.org/2022/05/16/1099256713/supreme-court-sides-with-sen-ted-cruz-in-campaign-finance-case

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The U.S. Supreme Court's conservative majority sided with Republican Sen. Ted Cruz on Monday, ruling that a federal ban on outsiders repaying a candidate's campaign loan to himself after an election violates the constitutional guarantee of free speech.

The vote was 6-to-3, with Chief Justice John Roberts writing the majority opinion.

Cruz challenged a federal law that has been on the books for 20 years. It bars federal candidates from raising more than $250,000 after an election to repay loans that the candidate made to his own campaign.

Since the loan is from the candidate personally. This allows the candidate to directly solicit money from lobbyists and others that benefit themselves personally. Oh, complete coincidence that a lobbyist repaying a million dollar personal loan has a bill I also support.

108
General Comments / Re: The Great Replacement?
« on: May 17, 2022, 12:52:48 PM »
Slightly different topic but I'll state my gun control position here again. High power semi automatic rifles with magazines that can be easily modified to allow for high capacity magazines should be banned. For everyone who says a couple hand guns with magazine changes are as deadly look at the death toll from the NY City subway shooter vs the people who use AR-15s. The AR-15 is the weapon of choice for mass shooters for a reason. It maximizes body count.

109
General Comments / Re: The Great Replacement?
« on: May 16, 2022, 02:56:53 PM »
Lloyd,
No comment on the shooters reasons for the shooting?

I have no idea what his reasons were.  I assume the guy is a racist *censored*. I also assume he is crazy. I would like to read what he posted online before the shooting but apparently, the ministry of truth doesn't think I should be able to.  I would also like to know what happened the last time he made threats but for some reason the feds wont release that information.

Not being available has nothing to do with the "Ministry of Truth" and everything to do with the media realizing that widely publishing the screeds of mass shooters encourages more mass shooting because some mass shooters just want their message heard far and wide. But he probably isn't crazy in any medical sense. Racist and filled with hate, yes.

110
General Comments / Re: The Great Replacement?
« on: May 16, 2022, 02:17:22 PM »
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So you support enabling the ATF to more efficiently track guns and gun sales so they can more easily identify straw purchasers and the gun dealers they buy from?

No, I don't support that.  I support charging criminals found with illegal guns with felonies and prosecuting them to the full extent of the law.  Rather than pleading them out to misdemeanors and releasing them back into the street.

Let me understand this. Your plan is to wait for criminals to commit crimes with fire arms before doing anything about it and then don't try to track down the networks that get guns in the hands of criminals in the first place?

111
General Comments / Re: The Great Replacement?
« on: May 16, 2022, 01:59:44 PM »
Meanwhile, 33 people shot in Chicago this weekend 5 fatally.

https://abc7chicago.com/chicago-shooting-weekend-violence-crime-police/11855997/

Nothing on the national news about that.

Sounds like another vote for “tax arms sales and body armor for everyone!”

More like a vote for "start enforcing the gun laws that are on the books".

So you support enabling the ATF to more efficiently track guns and gun sales so they can more easily identify straw purchasers and the gun dealers they buy from?

112
General Comments / Re: Whose cell/womb is it anyways?
« on: May 14, 2022, 01:15:48 PM »
Wonder how conservatives will react when gun rights don’t apply to self defense anymore and start allowing states to require gun owners to register for state and local militias.

113
General Comments / Re: Election Results
« on: May 13, 2022, 10:36:16 AM »
Well finally proof of ballot scamming. This is why Republicans are so sure it is happening. They are the ones doing it.

https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/gop-staffers-fired-wake-potential-225700710.html

So we have Mark Meadows registered to vote in 3 states. We have multiple verified cases of Republicans voting twice or voting for dead people.

All of this furor over voter fraud is just transference. They cheated and still lost. How emberassing.

Without the left going full blown investigation mode and law suit crazy they still found good evidence against a guy who potentially committed ballot fraud for a few dozen votes. They found the voters, interviewed them, identified the records of where the ballots where sent, all things I like to call evidence. Can you track down the 30 votes he cast and undo the effect, no. But just goes to show this stuff is detectable.

If there are 100,000s of thousands of votes like this submitted by Democrats why can't anyone find the evidence of it. 30 votes was detectable. I don't understand how anyone can claim that it is reasonable that this was done to the tune of 300,000 votes across 4-6 states that received a lot of scrutiny and you can't turn up one person as guilty as this Republican. Or hell, find a democrat as guilty as Mark Meadows. Apparently he decided to register in as many swing states as possible. Won't take long to see if he voted in multiple states as well.

114
General Comments / Re: We gotta talk about Uncle Joe
« on: May 13, 2022, 10:14:50 AM »
https://finance.yahoo.com/video/baby-formula-shortages-leaving-lot-205824458.html

Baby formula shortages 'are leaving a lot of parents in a bind

https://nypost.com/2022/05/12/border-detention-center-has-baby-formula-amid-shortage-photos/
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Kind of the exact opposite of America first. American infants go without while their nutrition takes a back seat to everyone else. That's Joe Biden's America. He's so generous he'd give a perfect stranger the shirt of your back, or the formula out of your baby's bottle. Of course as everyone will say in a story like this, that doesn't mean we shouldn't take care of people in need. It just means that when our own people are in need we should take care of them too.

Wow, what a BS story. Of course the border patrol feeds the people it detains. Failure to do so would be crimes against humanity. If the opposite were true, Fox would be running a story, Biden starves infants at border. Its not like the border patrol has a strategic baby formula stockpile that could alleviate the shortage. They probably have a small supply consistent with the need to feed infant children that get detained. Please think about the logic of what you are posting.

115
General Comments / Re: #Tweetstorm 14:1-5
« on: May 12, 2022, 12:28:12 PM »
The problem is that "all legal speech" means Twitter can't delete tweets that are only potentially libellous.

All legal speech includes a lot of stuff. Revenge porn is legal in a lot of states. Break up with someone with nude photos of you in the wrong state and they can splash them on your twitter feed or @/# them at you (however that works). Sure you can block/filter it but do all your friends and family have it blocked? Its legal, can't take it down. Can't ban the person who did it. Someone wants to recruit for the local KKK, plan rallies outside black churches on Sunday mornings. Not illegal they haven't killed anyone yet. Someone wants to take photos of cops in front of their house with the location tagged, post it with the question "Are they part of a death squad targeting minorities?" Answer is no. Just a question probably walks the line very close to illegal speech but would take a court case to decide. Libel and defamation are very hard to prove. It isn't an immediate call for violence. Just take a look at what the "all legal speech" zones of the internet become? Extremist hotbeds and recruiting grounds, Islamic terrorists, neo-nazi racists, et all. Musk may do us all a favor and kill twitter as a mainstream tool. But I doubt he wants to completely lose his investment. So he'll probably just relax the moderation a little. Do a couple high profile things like let Trump back on. And then start banning activists in Taiwan. Got to keep the Tesla supply chain from China flowing.

116
General Comments / Re: Election Results
« on: May 12, 2022, 12:06:08 PM »
Admit Lambert--D'Souza is a liar and you don't care.  You'll happily repeat his lies without ever looking at any criticism or checking to see if D'Souza is trustworthy.  As long as it fits your agenda, you don't care if the accusations are made out of whole cloth or not. 

So don't go lecturing us about us being "part of the crime."  It's that kind of rhetoric that makes people go to pizza parlors looking for pedophile rings in the basement when the place has no basement.  ;D  The biggest crime is how Republicans spread lies and then encourage people to commit crimes based on those lies.  That is something no one has a defense against.

So show some integrity yourself.  Vet what you read and stop spreading this B.S.  Start living again in the real world, for God's sake!  >:(

You just aided and abetted vote-scamming. If they go to prison, maybe it will splash over to you. Nothing D'Souza showed was out-of-line. As for who spreads lies. It was you and your Party activists who pushed the Steele Dossier which was paid for by Hillary and the DNC. Did you not notice that besides the scientific explanations in 2000 Mules was the use of the least probable guestimates? They proved some Mules delivered many illegal ballots but settled on afairly small number for each drop, even taking away a number that they may have legally been able to deliver from their immediate families (in dozens of different drop-boxes.)
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Please explain this to me. According to you D'Souza has clear evidence that the election was stolen. He has all this damning evidence from video and cell phones. So why does he makes a documentary instead of writing a detailed report that documents everything with links to the appropriate video along with the cell phone tracking data and sending it to the attorney generals in each of the states and the FBI. Why? Is his motivation profit or truth?

117
General Comments / Re: Whose cell/womb is it anyways?
« on: May 12, 2022, 11:48:44 AM »
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As Greg Guttfeld said, The Pro-Life argument is too simple for Abortion-Rights apologists to debunk. Life trumps murder. There is no Woman's right over her own body that lets her murder someone else. Adoption also trumps any inconvenience arguments.

By that logic sex leads to so much death that it should probably be outlawed. I mean somewhere between 1/4 and 1/2 of fertilized eggs never implant or lead to successful pregnancies. How can we allow an activity that we know will lead to killing 1/2 of the time???!!!!!!!

118
General Comments / Re: Trump looses again
« on: May 12, 2022, 11:20:03 AM »
...I pointed out two specific instances where he made high profile promises repeatedly and failed to deliver. Your response was democrats stopped the wall. In the areas where the wall was finished it didn't stop crossings. It has been breached multiple times and Mexico didn't pay. Its why we shouldn't spend hundreds of billions on a border wall. As to the taxes and financial records Trump provided the minimum required by law, not more than any other candidate in history. Unless you simply want to count the number of pages because Trump maintained his controlling interest in his business while being President. His finances are complicated therefore required more pages of required disclosure.

The wall money would have been better spent in a lot of ways. But how about on renewable energy and electric cars. We see the dire national security and economic consequences of relying on Saudi Arabia, Venezuela, Russia, and Iran to provide the world with energy supplies. What did Trump do on that? Tried to role back environmental and fuel efficiency standards that Obama put in.

If you want to discuss a topic, discuss it. I'm never going to engage with that data dump of copy and paste, I don't care where its from.

But that's what you just did. Admit it. Trump's promises to make Mexico pay for the wall was slowed because of Democrat foot-dragging - yet he went around them and got Mexico to pay in kind in trade concessions and providing Mexican soldiers to patrol on their side of the wall. He explains it in depth in almost every rally he gives, yet you've never heard it or understood it at all.

I don't take Trump's word for Trump's accomplishments. Just like I don't take his word that he is a "stable genius". How did the Democrats prevent Trump from getting Mexico to pay for the wall? They prevented him from wasting tax payer money on it. Last time I checked Republicans had full control of the house and senate for the first two years of Trump's term and budget reconciliation (which the wall could be built under isn't part of the filibuster). Mexico's trade "concessions" had nothing to do with the wall or did anything to get direct payments to the American government for construction of a wall that took only a few months to be repeatedly breached. I'm sure all the American service men whose base housing, schools, and facilities weren't upgraded are really happy that Trump took 4 billion from them to put towards his pet project that provides no safety or benefit to the country.

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I challenge you to look at that "data dump" you are so frightened of. Item after item. Pure unchallengeable metrics that you cannot argue out of existence. You especially missed all those things that Trump accomplished that the plagiarist, Biden, said he did.

How about a sample of your own verity? Explain the one statement that the average American family saved $2,500 a year in lower electric bills and lower prices at the gas pump.

Okay what is the source of $2,500 a year in lower electric bills and gas prices? I will look at any single item or two you want to discuss. I'm not going to play whack-a-mole from a giant list you just pasted in from somewhere else. Would you defend Trump as a honest man if I posted the 10,000 lies the Washington Post accumulated? Or would you want me to identify lies I thought were important and substantive (because many on the list of lies aren't either).

119
General Comments / Re: #Tweetstorm 14:1-5
« on: May 11, 2022, 02:11:36 PM »
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Our election has good fraud controls, not perfect fraud controls. States are getting better about auditing standards and verification. They aren't perfect, but they aren't is no way to prove any fraud. See Mark Meadows. See the idiot Republican in Pennsylvania who got caught voting for his dead mother. Clearly there are controls in place that flag this issues and allow them to be detected.

Yep, you can - in some circumstances - catch a dead voter, if they vote by mail and if the envelope is post marked and retained.  There are very few controls on the actual kinds of mail voter fraud that most likely influenced the election.  Voting stolen or abondoned ballots - particularly in the jurisdictions controlled by Dems that mailed unsolicited live ballots, manipulating the votes of the elderly - even when caught difficult to prove, heck stuffing extra ballots held in trunks under tables into the official tally after the observers leave (but forgetting about a security camera).  Even with witnesses, avadavits and other circumstantial evidence impossible catch or undo once the ballots are actually tallied (which de-links them from any security measures entirely). 
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Voting stolen ballots would be rather obvious when the person to whom the ballot was sent to shows up to vote and is informed they have already voted. Voting abandoned ballots risks the same discovery method. Instead of collecting lots of cell phone tracking data to discover mules. Maybe they could have just accessed the public voting records from jurisdictions that they think fraud occurred. Have a phone poll and ask people about their election participation. If someone says no they didn't vote, you have your evidence of a crime. If there are 100,000s of thousands of these people and you know which jurisdictions they are in then that type of polling operation can't be much more expensive than buying up all that cell phone data and tracking down surveillance footage to splice together in a misleading way. But no one decided to find any evidence of fraud (or they did try and failed so they said nothing). Trump had 500 million dollars to spend on this. The fact he didn't pursue any real investigations should tell you what he really thinks. You can do data analysis comparing polling, past voting results, historical voter turnout, with what happened in the current election and get circumstantial evidence for fraud. The right hasn't done any of that. The suitcases myth you are spreading is more disinformation. The Georgia SBI looked at the video and concluded those weren't suitcases but just the regular secure ballot storage cases. Nothing weird, other than a late call to ask people to stay late because of all the pressure to get things counted fast and Republican legislatures refusing to allow for the processing of mail in ballots before election day.

120
General Comments / Re: #Tweetstorm 14:1-5
« on: May 11, 2022, 01:36:59 PM »
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I don't want that community building up to the size of millions the way Alex Jones did. Its dangerous. So do you support taking something like that off twitter and twitter has taken down things on the left that are much milder than that. You just don't hear much about it because none of the absolutely disconnected from reality people on the left rise to reach an audience of millions before they get de-platformed.

Again, Alex Jones spread conspiracy theories and was known for that.  You have liberals that spread hate and conspiracy theories, like say Joy Reid with her 2.1 million twitter followers and television hosting gig that are not only completely unhinged but also not taken down and in fact repeatedly amplified.  Or people like Adam Schiff, with his 3 million followers, who've used their seat in the House to spread outright lies and disinformation free from any risk of punishment at law, and have faced absolutely no consequences on twitter for their role in spreading dangerous disinformation.  Many of his lies have been amplified by twitter statements and no response.

Is Joy Reid a host of the view? Name sounds familiar. If she is actively spreading lies and hate then report the posts to twitter and ask for her account to be banned. I really have no problem taking megaphones away from people who sow division through lies and misinformation.

121
General Comments / Re: Election Results
« on: May 11, 2022, 01:21:46 PM »
...What exactly would it prove if we did discover that a couple of hundred ballots did get harvested? It's not exactly an A-HA! moment that reveals that Mike Pence should have thrown away the election returns, or even that any outcome was affected even locally.

Go to any of the free streams of 2000 Mules and follow the science.
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Are you advocating us to engage in copyright infringement?

122
General Comments / Re: Election Results
« on: May 11, 2022, 01:20:52 PM »
2000 Mules stated that Trump should have received 305 electoral votes to 233 for Biden.

Great, I'm stating Trump should have won 0 electoral votes. Pay me $1,000,000 for me to show my work. No refunds.

123
General Comments / Re: #Tweetstorm 14:1-5
« on: May 10, 2022, 03:17:07 PM »
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Symbolism.  Do I need to go back and find old posts made on this board about such classic "legitimate" protests as Kathy Griffith with Trump's severed head?   Or how about all the times Trump or another Republican have been hung in effigy?  What makes one thing political speech and the other your form of a nightmare?  Heck, it only takes a second to pull up hundreds of such images on google.  Yet, I've NEVER ONCE heard you call for banning anyone who has shared them on social media.  Seems to me that the only difference in content you don't have a problem with and that which is terrifying demonstrates a clear need to erase the rights of the people is which team generated it.
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I don't troll around on those parts of the internet and am largely off social media. Hanging in effigy has a history, good or bad. I generally wouldn't consider simply those images to be calling for acts of violence. They walk the line and I really have no issue if twitter/youtube/facebook ban people who repost them, particularly if they add violent captions.

I'm more concerned about the information bubbles, of which you think I'm a part of despite not being on any real social media. But largely because I don't believe the things you do about "Hunter Biden's" laptop. Hunter got a cushy job because his dad was vice president. The evidence indicates he committed some tax law violations and potentially some foreign lobbying standards. The DOJ is currently investigating with a grand jury. Maybe he goes to jail. Maybe Biden pardons him. Maybe he gets acquitted. I don't believe the narrative that the laptop was his and contained child porn and the FBI ignored that and said lets go after him for tax evasion instead.

Are you claiming that the Republican administrations in Georgia and Arizona were in deep with the Democrats to rig the election against Trump? Our election has good fraud controls, not perfect fraud controls. States are getting better about auditing standards and verification. They aren't perfect, but they aren't is no way to prove any fraud. See Mark Meadows. See the idiot Republican in Pennsylvania who got caught voting for his dead mother. Clearly there are controls in place that flag this issues and allow them to be detected. Did we catch every individual who double voted? No. Was there potentially some small time ballet harvester out there? Probably. Are the controls and investigations good enough to detect something on the order of 10,000 votes? Yes. So quit equating I no one can verify that 100% of votes are valid with we can say with a very high degree of confidence that 99.99% of votes are valid.

For the BLM lets take it one step farther than the war language. If there was an account that was doxing police officers and making repeated claims that the doxed officers were part of a secret death squad that was running around killing black people. Maybe they mix some real police violence video in with some selectively edited and doctored up. Does that cross the line for you? It does for me. I don't want that community building up to the size of millions the way Alex Jones did. Its dangerous. So do you support taking something like that off twitter and twitter has taken down things on the left that are much milder than that. You just don't hear much about it because none of the absolutely disconnected from reality people on the left rise to reach an audience of millions before they get de-platformed.

124
General Comments / Re: Election Results
« on: May 10, 2022, 12:37:57 PM »
There is no credibility to D'Souza. He's been shown to edit things in a shady way, pull quotes out of context, and the material generally represents a big money grab. If his intent is really to expose terrible vote fraud, why isn't it released into the public domain? I'm sure as hell not giving him $20 so I can have my arguments fall on deaf ears. As for the video in question that purports to show the same person dropping multiple ballots "in the middle of the night", I'd review it if it were available. I'm assuming its just a one minute montage, and not available in any trailers.
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I made the same assumptions about D'Souza without knowing anything about him. Just the fact that he put his argument out in only video form. Charging $20 a pop for it is hilarious. That alone shows he doesn't care anything about voting integrity, just getting his share of the right wing big lie graft. 

125
General Comments / Re: #Tweetstorm 14:1-5
« on: May 10, 2022, 12:27:37 PM »
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So see my prior post.  Remove all left wing politicians for their inspiring of anti-fa violence.  And no disputing that their responsible, the standard you're articulating is unproven and barely sourced responsibility.   It should apply both ways.

In fact, the people who make death threats should be the ones in trouble, not the people who make the "inspiring" posts (which really aren't inspiring of the conduct).  If real people are connected to the accounts that should be easy to do.  Those death threats are coming electronically, why not dox those people.  Won't take long to week out such illegal content and then there's no more "harm."
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So I should be free to create an anonymous twitter account post non stop that someone is a Nazi child abuser. Create deep fakes that purport to show them doing those things, publish their address and then be completely free of responsibility if someone gets violent against that person? Even if all that crap is false? Most of it is defamation but that's what you are arguing for, twitter can't stop me. What if my account is anonymous or located in Russia? Can't sue then, it just gets to stay up and continue defaming and ruining peoples lives? Free speech right? Twitter just has to host and broadcast to the world the most despicable content that damages reputations and lives because ... freedom?

No one is arguing that these people go to jail for their lies and disinformation. Just that we let platforms have some standards as to what is acceptable and help prevent radicalization and extremism. Should twitter have kept ISIS accounts active? Help them broadcast their message of hate to the world and recruit more followers?

126
General Comments / Re: #Tweetstorm 14:1-5
« on: May 10, 2022, 12:10:09 PM »
Why are you so scared of letting others make their own decisions on this?

January 6th.

You're scared of a protest that went too far?  Or are you scared of the active disinformation campaign pretending that it was an insurrection?  Or are you scared of the abuse of power that involved impeaching a sitting President in connection with it?  Or is it something else?
...

A protest that went too far killing police at the capital? A protest that went too far erecting gallows and saying they were going to hang the vice president and speaker of the house? A protest that lowered the American flag to raise a Trump flag over the capital? A protest fueled by rage generated by lies that the President told? Yes all those things concern me. Impeaching Trump was the least that should be done to that demagogue. There is a direct logical chain from his lies, his rally, his call to march to the capital, to fight to keep from losing your country to the violence at the capital that day. McConnel and Graham saw it that day calling Trump morally and practically responsible for what happened. Prison for incitement would be reasonable. I know incitement is almost impossible to prove in America but he caused death with his words that day.

What scares me is that when you let people form their own information bubbles online all the crazies can find each other and form self reinforcing groups. Getting those 10,000 most extreme people together on one day with the most extreme of those having planned for breaching the capital led to the violence we saw. Without those self reinforcing extremist bubbles most of those people would have never shown up or if they had would have never thought to storm the capital. The same thing is possible on the left if they start going all out on misinformation. Imagine a hypothetical super extremist wing of BLM, ones that say the police are at war with people and they need to respond with a war on the police. Parts of BLM have been suspended on twitter for walking too close to that line and its a good thing. Having those self reinforcing information hate bubbles is dangerous on the right and the left.

127
General Comments / Re: #Tweetstorm 14:1-5
« on: May 09, 2022, 07:44:30 PM »
Or disinformation attacked as disinformation, like when Alex Jones got the boot for saying the Sandy Hook Massacre was not real. Which was doing real harm, as proven by a court judgement. Musk's "all things legal standard" would have ignored his dangerous disinformation. Note that what he did wasn't illegal, as in criminal, at least no one has tried to charge him criminally.

What was dangerous about it?  Seriously, that's like arguing that the crazies who claim the moon landing was fake were dangerous.  Almost as crazy as not banning any talk of COVID escaping from a lab... oh wait, we did do that for no reason that's actually articulable.

Letting Alex Jones speak on this discredited him to virtually everyone that heard him.  Suppressing it would have discredited him to virtually no one.

Letting Alex Jones speak got the affected families doxed and death threats. Because crazy to 99.9% of people still leads to a lot of badly misinformed people when your audience is in the millions. I’m not arguing locking him up. Just taking away his megaphone and ability to reach millions.

128
General Comments / Re: The Jan 6 Commission
« on: May 09, 2022, 04:31:15 PM »
I should have moved my argument back into the other thread, sorry everyone. I lost track of which thread we were in.

I lost track of the thread too  :o

129
General Comments / Re: The Jan 6 Commission
« on: May 09, 2022, 03:49:13 PM »
We need a big Senate and House majority. The solution maybe to abolish the filibuster and expand the court to 15 justices. Its drastic but constitutional and legal.

I get that politics is a battlefield and the biggest battles require use of any weapons necessary to win. However I guess my question is: what happened to the idea that the other side simply has a different belief about life? In other words, yes, the left-wing side is losing this battle in certain states if Roe is overturned, but isn't that merely reflective of the fact that many people disagree with the left on this?

While it's obviously a big deal that this precedent should be overturned, what if it's actually the legally correct move, putting aside the politics of it? Sure, you could argue it's only happening now because of the SCOTUS composition, but that doesn't automatically imply the ruling is invalid (if they do proceed and make it). Maybe it's best for the matter to be settled the correct way, by voters expressing their views locally rather than a body of unelected officials deciding for everyone based on, presumably, their own biases?


Expanding the court would be the only option if they go one step further and decide fertilized eggs to be humans with all the protections afforded under the constitution. And since the draft opinion explicitly refers to the life of the fetus being of particular concern here it isn't outside the realm of possibility to think that today is overturning Roe and next year they SC says instead of abortion being a right, it is actually illegal everywhere.

Also there is an issue when we begin to allow majorities to vote away the rights of others. Less than 50% of voters are capable of conceiving. Teen girls have no vote but are probably some of the largest impacted by such decisions. Rape victims could be forced to carry a pregnancy to term. I'm not saying it isn't a complex moral issue. But the burdens of lack of choice are not felt universally. And the way many legislatures have worded laws and personhood amendments in the past would actually outlaw most forms of birth control that simply prevent implantation instead of feralization. If the SC goes extreme, expanding the court or amending the constitution is the only solution.

130
General Comments / Re: The Jan 6 Commission
« on: May 09, 2022, 03:03:58 PM »
There's a world of difference between a mob trying to storm the capitol because of a fantasy about the election and people protesting the ongoing attempt to create a theocratic white ethnostate.

Yes, but no reason for violence or threats of violence against SC justices. Because literally short of killing them protesting/threatening them does nothing. This is their whole life's work to overturn Roe. So leave the threats (implicit or explicit) aside and work the problem like a rational member of a democracy. We need a big Senate and House majority. The solution maybe to abolish the filibuster and expand the court to 15 justices. Its drastic but constitutional and legal.

131
General Comments / Re: The Jan 6 Commission
« on: May 09, 2022, 02:46:54 PM »
They've put up some significant barricades at the SC.  There may be issues making their voices heard. Not to mention at some point you have to start threatening the government.
...

Other ways. Vote the people who put them in charge out of power. Gerrymandering and unequal representation in the Senate complicate those issues. But thinking that threatening SC justices whose whole careers have been groomed by the right to overturn Roe is going to have any impact is absurd. Fight at the state level. Win elections. Don't become Trumpists who violently attack the government like toddlers throwing a temper tantrum.

132
General Comments / Re: The Jan 6 Commission
« on: May 09, 2022, 02:28:14 PM »
But the peaceful protest in front of the houses of the SC Justices are violent protest that should not be allowed.

Actually, I don't like protests in front of private residences, no matter how justified and peaceful they are. Protest at the SC, you can make your voice heard without being threatening. Because no matter how peaceful and calm a protest a group of angry people on your front lawn is threatening.

133
General Comments / Re: The Jan 6 Commission
« on: May 09, 2022, 01:33:06 PM »
...

You sadden me, because you act like you have enough brains not to be an idiot moron - yet you repeat the most easily rebuttable disinformation and re-post enough almost factual info to skew basic facts.

The January 6th protest was a valid exercise in people's rights to freely express their distrust of how the election was handled. Pelosi disallowed the security that was asked for, and it was her people that directed people (hers?) into the building. (We have that on video so it is unarguable.) The Doctrine of Laches says such an action allows all entries to be legal, and permitted by the Speaker.

I mean this with no irony or sarcasm. I am glad you are here engaging with people you disagree with.

Welcome to ornery, you are wrong.

134
General Comments / Re: The Jan 6 Commission
« on: May 09, 2022, 01:30:51 PM »
...
Comparing Hillary's willful violations to hide her Clinton Crime Family details  is not at all in the same mold as Trump (who held the power and authority of all security settings and clearances) legally putting anything he wanted, anywhere. As for the effect of these separate actions, Hillary's actions killed people:
...

This was after he quit being President. He lost all those rights. So he stole classified material from the US government and stored it at his private residence. But again, I'm fine if you want to try Hillary as a felony and Trump under the misdemeanor statute.

135
General Comments / Re: The Jan 6 Commission
« on: May 09, 2022, 12:10:51 PM »
...
Where is your reposting of anything to do with the hundreds of riots that burned government buildings and killed people during the Democrat Summer of Love? Where are your repostings of Democrat operatives in the Justice Department who lied about Trump, Russian collusion (except for Hillary), and paid-for intelligence reports that lied about Trump? Why isn't Hillart prosecuted for violation of laws that Comey refused to prosecute because of "lack of intent" for violations that specifically said that intent is not relevant. The submarine snap-shotter spent time behinf bars - Hillary skated.

U suggest we know someone for what he/she is for what they ignore, as much as for what they pass along as truth, which is actually political disinformation.

Plenty of people discussed the riots after the George Floyd murder. Everyone condemned the violence of the looters and provocateurs. People looting the local 7-11 just isn't a lasting news story and concern like the President pointing a mob at the congress and watching joyfully while they erected gallows and sent them away with much love.

Let's send Hillary and Trump to jail for storing classified information incorrectly. Hillary had her under-encrypted email server and Trump had boxes full of materials sitting around Mara Lago. I wouldn't lose sleep about either being hauled before a jury for their actions.

136
General Comments / Re: The Jan 6 Commission
« on: May 09, 2022, 11:17:04 AM »
https://www.npr.org/2022/05/02/1095521376/jan-6-panel-asks-three-new-house-republicans-to-testify-voluntarily

Quote
House Republican Reps. Mo Brooks of Alabama, Andy Biggs of Arizona, and Ronny Jackson of Texas on Monday rejected requests from the House select Jan. 6 committee to testify voluntarily regarding the attack on the Capitol.

I have nothing to hide but won't say anything under oath.

137
General Comments / Re: Election Results
« on: May 09, 2022, 10:23:10 AM »
Some looked into the claim WmLambert made on the last page about ballot "mules".

https://www.yahoo.com/news/fact-focus-gaping-holes-claim-200655794.html

Yeah it seems like it might not be the most reliable information.

You haven't even seen the documentary bu D'Souza, have you? Many states allow a family member to drop off family ballots, but make ballot harvesting illegal. The video shows the same person dropping off many ballots at many different ballot collection boxes in the wee hours of the night. You don't need cell-phome tracking to see the vote-scamming. The video goes to great length to document illegality. Opinion hit pieces don't negayte that.

So you found one potential vote harvester after two years of investigation. Why did they put out their information as a video documentary? Why not a detailed written report that shows sources, explains details, etc. I'll tell you why, a detailed written report has to hold water, a video is much more fuzzy, people have to try to track down your sources to see if you are manipulating data.

Also are you sure you're seeing the same person dropping off ballets at different locations at different times? Or just a couple guys who look alike? Or the same location from multiple angles? Or a pastor who is dropping off ballets for his congregants? A close family/friend dropping off ballets for elderly congregants who have trouble getting out.

There may have been a handful of vote harvesters out there. But definitely nothing on the scale of the thousands claimed. That's the problem with what your sources claim, they claimed to have found 10,000 mules across multiple states. What they have shown is circumstantial evidence for 1. And showing fraud on the order of 10s of votes doesn't invalidate the election in the slightest. No system is going to be absolutely perfect but  we can be very, very, very confident that the vote fraud wasn't on the order of 10-100 thousand votes across multiple states and all we can detect is the occasional republican double vote and illegal registration (Mark Meadows).

138
General Comments / Re: Whose cell/womb is it anyways?
« on: May 09, 2022, 10:05:14 AM »
Probably shouldn't have even engaged on that front. Just another right wing talking point to distract from how unpopular their abortion policies are overall. The leak, Afghanistan, just ignore us outlawing abortions in every state we can.

139
General Comments / Re: Whose cell/womb is it anyways?
« on: May 09, 2022, 10:03:25 AM »
I've never been one to say that we have to go to war everywhere to fight for women's rights. Obviously that's going to make things a lot worse for everyone, including the women there. Go to war in Saudi Arabia to fight for women's right to abortion there? Counterproductive.

But we had already won in Afghanistan. We didn't fight for women's rights of course. That was nowhere on the agenda. But we had them won already anyway with no need to give them up.
...

We hadn't won in Afghanistan. The fighting was ongoing. Progress was being made, maybe we needed another 20 years. But corruption and tribalism prevented any real idea of national unity. In the end Afghans weren't willing to fight without Americans standing beside and behind them. That speaks to our 20 year failure there. A lot of things we could have done differently. But at the end of the day it is what it is. We should have been training women to fight in the Afghan army. Maybe they wouldn't have abandoned their posts the second we weren't there to back them up because they had something real to fight for. This is a bipartisan American failure. To claim Trump would have done better is an iffy preposition at best. He announced multiple times he was leaving, he negotiated leaving, to claim he would have reversed course last minute when things were going bad, maybe, but doesn't seem likely.

140
General Comments / Re: Trump looses again
« on: May 09, 2022, 09:20:58 AM »
Wm, I have no interest in reading, refuting, or agreeing with what ever website you copy and pasted that from. You want to have a discussion, bring up what you think is good and important don’t drop in the greatest hits from “trump is great dot com.”

Would you engage with me if I just posted the Washington posts list of trump’s 10,000 lies?

That is from the official White House website cataloging the Trump accomplishments. Nothing posted because of opinion - just pure metrics.
...

I don't care what Trump says Trump did. I pointed out two specific instances where he made high profile promises repeatedly and failed to deliver. Your response was democrats stopped the wall. In the areas where the wall was finished it didn't stop crossings. It has been breached multiple times and Mexico didn't pay. Its why we shouldn't spend hundreds of billions on a border wall. As to the taxes and financial records Trump provided the minimum required by law, not more than any other candidate in history. Unless you simply want to count the number of pages because Trump maintained his controlling interest in his business while being President. His finances are complicated therefore required more pages of required disclosure.

The wall money would have been better spent in a lot of ways. But how about on renewable energy and electric cars. We see the dire national security and economic consequences of relying on Saudi Arabia, Venezuela, Russia, and Iran to provide the world with energy supplies. What did Trump do on that? Tried to role back environmental and fuel efficiency standards that Obama put in.

If you want to discuss a topic, discuss it. I'm never going to engage with that data dump of copy and paste, I don't care where its from.

141
General Comments / Re: Trump looses again
« on: May 07, 2022, 09:48:30 PM »
Wm, I have no interest in reading, refuting, or agreeing with what ever website you copy and pasted that from. You want to have a discussion, bring up what you think is good and important don’t drop in the greatest hits from “trump is great dot com.”

Would you engage with me if I just posted the Washington posts list of trump’s 10,000 lies?

142
General Comments / Re: Whose cell/womb is it anyways?
« on: May 07, 2022, 03:17:05 PM »
Quote
Given the clear understanding of how pregnancy happens and the vast array of methods to prevent it
I also think more focus should be focus on preventing the issue in the first place.
...

As our old friend Pete pointed out frequently Obama deserves credit more than any other politician since Roe for bringing down the number of abortions. Making contraceptives a basic part of all health insurance and expanding coverage has brought the number of abortions in America to its lowest level since Roe became law. Giving people access to health care works.

143
General Comments / Re: #Tweetstorm 14:1-5
« on: May 07, 2022, 09:49:47 AM »
Why are you so scared of letting others make their own decisions on this?

January 6th.

I’m surprised you don’t see the danger as well. Considering your rightful concern about people openly calling for the killing of white people or cops. Such actors shouldn’t be given a public megaphone to recruit and radicalize. They can say all the nasty crap they want drinking in their backyard. We don’t need to have a forum that lets them easily and relatively anonymously broadcast that to the world.

144
General Comments / Re: #Tweetstorm 14:1-5
« on: May 07, 2022, 09:22:32 AM »
Why are you so scared of letting others make their own decisions on this?

January 6th.

145
General Comments / Re: Whose cell/womb is it anyways?
« on: May 06, 2022, 03:17:39 PM »
...

Also, there's a HUGE variety of birth control methods now. Condoms, the pill, implants, IUDs, etc. Plan B is available OTC if you have a concern. None of these are expensive. They are all insanely easy to get. And, of course, you can always not engage in sexual intercourse - 100% guaranteed to not get pregnant.
...

And if a condom breaks or birth control pills don't work? Just live with being an unexpected parent? And if most of those birth control methods are outlawed by the same people defining life beginning when sperm meets egg? Just enjoy your celebrant lifestyle or your 12 kids?

146
General Comments / Re: Whose cell/womb is it anyways?
« on: May 06, 2022, 02:27:20 PM »
How long before some personhood amendments that define life starting when sperm meets egg inadvertently outlaw the pill and all other birth control methods that prevent implantation instead of feralization? We're going to create a whole new generation of bootleggers, but instead of alcohol they are going to be smuggling birth control pills and sneaking out of state to get an IUD. Would a man having sex with his wife who got an out of state IUD be guilty of accessory to murder? How about a couple traveling through the state from Colorado, could they be arrested for bringing birth control pills. Having sex in the wrong state, potentially fertilizing and egg and preventing implantation? If life begins at sperm meets egg, that is the country we will live in. For a few years anyway. We'll see how long it takes for Republicans to realize almost no one wants to live the handmaidens tale. Wonder what the extradition battles are going to be like, women fleeing from Texas to California, requesting asylum. Guess it will be interesting if you are a lawyer. Sucks for the average citizen.

147
General Comments / Re: Whose cell/womb is it anyways?
« on: May 06, 2022, 10:29:25 AM »
...

And how long before another Supreme Court is going to overturn the previous one.  :D

Based on life expectancy, probably a couple decades.

148
General Comments / Re: Whose cell/womb is it anyways?
« on: May 06, 2022, 10:07:57 AM »
You said it, Ouija.

Abortion is going to be Class One Felony Murder in one state, and a protected medical procedure in the state next door.  How long before the Supreme Court is going to have to adjudicate on the difference?

And how long before another Supreme Court is going to overturn the previous one.  :D

And how many women are local prosecutors in Texas or Alabama going to arrest and charge with murder for traveling to California for an abortion? Sure the prosecution probably won't hold up, but it would you want to risk your freedom on that jury trial? Not to mention the cost of a lawyer and harm of pre-trial detention.

149
General Comments / Re: #Tweetstorm 14:1-5
« on: May 06, 2022, 10:02:57 AM »
...
Quote
In a few years, almost anything will be possible. Currently Twitter bans misleading videos. That would end if Musk allows everything that is legal. It will lead to a proliferation of deepfakes like the one above.

This is going to happen regardless.  Having twitter open means they will be capable of being directly countered.  Having it censored just means the left's deepfakes will stay up and real videos critical of the left will be removed as "deepfakes."
...

Quote
Hateful content: Twitter currently has a policy against hateful content. You can't compare Black people to monkeys, fat women to pigs, Jews to Nazis, and a whole range of other outrageous parallels that are perfectly legal to say. Once the Musk rules take over, expect tons of this, aimed at many different groups.

This policy was always wrong headed.  People have a right to hate and express hate.  You should have a right to filter it out.  You don't need a woke censor to choose to suppress this or note.
...

How often do you troll around on 8chan? I don't, its not a good section of internet. Forcing everyone to block every internet troll is harmful to user experience and society. Forget being a public woman on twitter with no content standards. How many lude remarks and harassing messages are okay per day? How many people would walk right up to violent threats? You manage to participate as a civil member of society on this forum despite our moderation rules. Smaller scale but same idea. To foster civil discussion we have some standards. Some members walk fine lines around those standards but generally it works to allow people to largely discuss ideas without threatening each other or devolving into trading insults. Saying twitter shouldn't have any standards because people should be free to express hate as much as they want is crazy. Why can't twitter try to have a reasonable user experience without every Jew on twitter having to block every white nationalist neo nazi bone head who wants to say horrible things to them constantly. If someone is harming the user experience for the majority of users by expressing hate and being hurtful constantly, twitter (as a private entity) has the right to kick them off. The government can't put them in jail for their speech but getting kicked off twitter isn't a government action, first amendment doesn't apply.

The problem with your solution of just block them is that for many people (women, Jews, black people, probably everyone else) their whole twitter experience would end up being consumed by blocking the worst million online trolls before they could actually engage with whatever community they wanted to in the first place.

150
General Comments / Re: Whose cell/womb is it anyways?
« on: May 05, 2022, 06:03:31 PM »
But it should be within the scope of their legal acumen to critique past decisions they have all the documentation, facts, and legal reasoning on.

You could ask me right now what I think about some factual topic, but requiring analysis. Let's say it's the behavior of the Federal Reserve during the 2008 crisis. I have read about it, heard testimony, seen the results of some investigations, and I have a private opinion on the matter. Even if I was an expert and had a somewhat more sophisticated opinion it would still be just that. But now if you officially task me with investigating it myself and coming to 'final conclusions' to the best of my ability, that would be something else. Someone can study something all they want in abstraction, but if the task is actually a reality and present-tense decisions need to be made, that colors and changes everything. Of course new study would be needed, which maybe could affect or even reverse your previous position. You should only hope the justices would have that much of an open mind.

If you were before the Senate for a confirmation hearing for Fed chair and couldn't/wouldn't provide intelligent analysis about significant periods in Fed history then you are probably unqualified. If they had a solid legal reasoning that they felt Roe is poorly decided/reasoned they could put those arguments forward then. Judges should view every case on its own merits but to say a supreme court justice can't/shouldn't express a legal analysis of previous significant rulings is disingenuous.

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