Author Topic: London Bridge is Falling?  (Read 1778 times)

NobleHunter

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London Bridge is Falling?
« on: September 08, 2022, 11:58:33 AM »
The UK is apparently cuing up the national freak out for when Queen Elizabeth II dies. Given how things are like over there, this is not good timing.

While it's not that relevant to Canada, I think we'll "have" to replace a whole bunch of portraits and do a find and replace of King for Queen. I think I might be displeased about the money we'll spend on it. It also feels weird to have something change that's been a constant for about as long as my parents have been alive.

I feel like major disruption in Canada because someone in another country dies would be an argument against keeping the monarchy part of constitutional monarchy, but if we barely even notice (which is what I expect to happen, official pageantry of grief aside) that also seems to an argument against keeping the monarch as the head of state.

Tom

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #1 on: September 08, 2022, 12:23:46 PM »
I bet they're glad that most of the metal plaques just reference "HRH".

NobleHunter

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #2 on: September 08, 2022, 01:44:16 PM »

msquared

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #3 on: September 08, 2022, 01:44:24 PM »
It did not take long. Dead at 96

Grant

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #4 on: September 12, 2022, 01:49:10 PM »
"So gorgeous was the spectacle on the May morning of 1910 when nine kings rode in the funeral of Edward II of England that the crowd, waiting in hushed and black-clad awe, could not keep back gasps of admiration.  In scarlet and blue and green and purple, three by three the sovereigns rode through the palace gates, with plumed helmets, gold braid, crimson sashes, and jeweled orders flashing in the sun.  After them came five heirs apparent, forty more imperial or royal highnesses, seven queens- four dowagers and three regnant-and a scattering of special ambassadors from uncrowned countries.  Together they represented seventy nations in the greatest assemblage of royalty and rank ever gathered in one place and, of its kind, the last.  The muffled tongue of Big Ben trolled nine by the clock as the cortege left the palace, but on history's clock it was sunset, and the sun of the old world was setting in a dying blaze of splendor never to be seen again."


I wonder how the world will change now.  What sun is setting now.  What will never be seen again.  Within 50 years, the monarchies of five of the nine Kings of 1910 were ended.  The new world was baptized in blood in 1914, and confirmed again in 1939.  Since 1952 it's not exactly been peaches and cream, but it wasn't '14 to '45 either. 

NobleHunter

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #5 on: September 12, 2022, 02:01:30 PM »
It'll be a lot the dominions to ditch the monarchy. I'm not sure if they will or not. But neither Chucky nor William invoke the same warm fuzzies that Elizabeth did. If we going to cut the cord, now makes more sense than later.

TheDrake

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #6 on: September 12, 2022, 02:17:09 PM »
New Zealand looks like they are going to stick around for a while with the whole constitutional monarchy thing.

msquared

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #7 on: September 12, 2022, 02:18:59 PM »
The Cayman Islands will most likely stay.

NobleHunter

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #8 on: September 12, 2022, 02:21:42 PM »
Correction: a lot easier.

Cayman Islands are an overseas territory like Bermuda so they've a lot more to lose if they separate.

The monarch in Canada is mostly about decorating choices and iconography. It's changing the constitution and coming up with a replacement that would be difficult.

TheDrake

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #9 on: September 12, 2022, 03:01:19 PM »
And the UK is gonna get some new money soon? Or do they follow the US tradition of having dead leaders on the cash?

msquared

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #10 on: September 12, 2022, 03:12:26 PM »
They will change over to Charles as they replace bills. I do not think they have to turn in money and get new bills, but the place that prints new bills is probably printing new bills with Charles image now.

DJQuag

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #11 on: September 12, 2022, 03:17:10 PM »
They will change over to Charles as they replace bills. I do not think they have to turn in money and get new bills, but the place that prints new bills is probably printing new bills with Charles image now.

This is correct.

The old money will still be valid, just as some coins showing George VI still was, but any new money printed will be with the new King's head attached.

ETA - Thought you guys would like this. The actual bills of our money are all different sized. If you're anything like my brother in law, you're about to ask why.

It's for blind people.
« Last Edit: September 12, 2022, 03:19:25 PM by DJQuag »

DJQuag

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #12 on: September 12, 2022, 03:22:12 PM »
Correction: a lot easier.

Cayman Islands are an overseas territory like Bermuda so they've a lot more to lose if they separate.

The monarch in Canada is mostly about decorating choices and iconography. It's changing the constitution and coming up with a replacement that would be difficult.

I heard from one guy whose only complaint was what it would cost to replace all of the signs.

Grant

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #13 on: September 12, 2022, 05:54:37 PM »
"So gorgeous was the spectacle on the May morning of 1910 when nine kings rode in the funeral of Edward II of England that the crowd...."

This was supposed to be Edward VII, not Edward II.  Edward II of course being the son of Edward I (Longshanks or Hammer of the Scots) of Braveheart fame, and Edward VII being the son of Victoria.  Separated by 700 years. 

Grant

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #14 on: September 14, 2022, 02:53:36 PM »
There is a saying that queuing is a British past-time.  Well they seem to be determined to prove the point.  The queue for observing the late Queen lying in state is now 2.6 mi long.  It will probably get longer.  It will be "paused" (what does that mean?) if it reaches 10 miles in length.  Easily up to 12 hours wait in line.  Bathrooms set up.  Can't really find how fast the line is moving.  But assuming it is moving between 0.1 and 0.3 mph, you're looking at 13 hour wait.  Better than Space Mountain.  With a maximum wait time of around 50 hours if the queue gets to 10 miles.  If it gets to that length, there should be some kind of medal or British honour set up for those who survive. 

Grant

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #15 on: September 14, 2022, 03:29:15 PM »
Watching the video feed from inside Westminister Hall.  Kinda disappointed that some of the people of London/Britain can't find something black to wear for their deceased monarch.  I've seen better dress at a funeral in South Mississippi. 

This changing the guard thing is slowing down the queue.  UK needs to invest in robot/android guardbots.  Talk to Musk. 

Imagine waiting 13 plus hours to walk by somebody's coffin, draped in a flag with a crown and wreath on it.  If I didn't do that for Carrie Fisher, I just don't think I could do that for anybody.  Maybe Catherine Bach or Erin Grey.  But they're both still alive.

Grant

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #16 on: September 14, 2022, 03:46:51 PM »
So at 1 person per meter, with the line split in two getting into Westminster, with each person getting 5 seconds to bow/curtsie/salute, you can get through 1 mile a people an hour and 7 minutes. 

IF they weren't changing the guard every 20 minutes and halting everybody. 

NobleHunter

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #17 on: September 14, 2022, 03:56:18 PM »
So about 4,000 people in line? That doesn't seem like a lot, relatively speaking.

My social media is very anti-monarchist so I don't know how many Britons are actively engaged with mourning versus pageantry enacted by the government for their own legitimacy.

Grant

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #18 on: September 14, 2022, 04:50:01 PM »
So about 4,000 people in line? That doesn't seem like a lot, relatively speaking.

My social media is very anti-monarchist so I don't know how many Britons are actively engaged with mourning versus pageantry enacted by the government for their own legitimacy.

Well, if they are able to get 1600 through every hour, and they are running round the clock, until sometime on Monday, they will run a bit less than 200,000 people through.  I guess that's really not a lot, but it's more than will be at my funeral so I don't think I could think of it as small. 

I'm watching this thing on youtube non-stop.  It's captivating.  Just watching these people's faces and how they do different things.  Different bows.  Some Catholics make the sign of the cross.  Some woman brought her disabled daughter in a wheelchair.  Some cry afterwards. 

It's the MOST REAL thing I've seen so far.  Everything else was pageantry, which I can get understand.  But it's rare to see so much televised respect and grief.  All walks of life.  All races.  It's captivating. 

I mean, it's one thing to stand in line for 2-3 hours for your 5 seconds.  That's crazy enough.  But just watching these people's faces. 

NobleHunter

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #19 on: September 14, 2022, 04:54:31 PM »
200k is a reasonable sample and if it's the theoretical maximum, it shows that more would have gone if they could.

If it is real grief, then it's reassuring that there's some support for the cost of the funeral and assorted inconveniences. Maybe not enough to justify them but it's not just the government being a bag of dicks.

TheDrake

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #20 on: September 14, 2022, 06:34:08 PM »
Quote
Imagine waiting 13 plus hours to walk by somebody's coffin, draped in a flag with a crown and wreath on it.

Imagine waiting 7 hours to cast a ballot every 2-4 years.

Grant

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #21 on: September 14, 2022, 08:04:56 PM »
Imagine waiting 7 hours to cast a ballot every 2-4 years.

We all think that you are very pretty too, sweetie. 

Grant

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #22 on: September 14, 2022, 08:29:16 PM »
Dangit!  I missed the first guard passing out!  Right during changing the guard.  He only had to hang on another 2 minutes and he would have made it. 

cherrypoptart

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #23 on: September 15, 2022, 04:13:13 AM »
It's probably too late for this now but maybe for next time you go by the take a number system and you can watch online or on tv to see what number is up and what your expected wait time is. If you want to save paper maybe have an option to get your number on the app and you just show it on your phone when you're getting close. I suppose that defeats the purpose of showing the proper respect. Well at least it's not as bad as Shaka Zulu's mom's funeral.

The trick to not passing out is make sure you don't lock your knees. That's what we learned in boot camp. A lot of people still passed out anyway though.

I paid my respects privately with a prayer for her soul up in heaven, condolences to her family, and best wishes to her country and the good people of her empire.

Grant

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #24 on: September 15, 2022, 08:07:37 AM »
It's probably too late for this now but maybe for next time you go by the take a number system and you can watch online or on tv to see what number is up and what your expected wait time is. If you want to save paper maybe have an option to get your number on the app and you just show it on your phone when you're getting close. I suppose that defeats the purpose of showing the proper respect. Well at least it's not as bad as Shaka Zulu's mom's funeral.

The queue is now 4.2 miles long.  I have been reliably informed, several times, that nobody can queue like the British can.  So I will not presume to instruct them on their national past-time. 

Quote
The trick to not passing out is make sure you don't lock your knees.

Yes.  But the real culprit here is the Monarchy.  :P Despite the fact that probably more people have passed out at American military Change of Command or Graduation ceremonies. 

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I paid my respects privately with a prayer for her soul up in heaven, condolences to her family, and best wishes to her country and the good people of her empire.

Minor quibble here, Cherry.  But I think they call it a "Commonwealth" now instead of "Empire".  People are already riled up enough blaming QEII for colonization and being part of the system.  Though maybe that is your goal.  To get them riled up.  I'd rather not. 

NobleHunter

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #25 on: September 15, 2022, 08:12:24 AM »
I like the idea that the British just enjoy forming a queue, even if it would be more sensible to do it virtually.

TheDeamon

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #26 on: September 15, 2022, 08:47:54 AM »
The trick to not passing out is make sure you don't lock your knees. That's what we learned in boot camp. A lot of people still passed out anyway though.

Sometimes the cause of their passing out isn't about having locked their knees, dehydration, stress, and other factors can combine together to take people down all the same. In that respect, "bending your knees" simply becomes their form of a stress ball to try to keep them together.

Grant

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #27 on: September 15, 2022, 05:12:47 PM »
Now 4.9 miles.  9 hour wait time.  Leads me to believe they're not getting a mile done every hour, but about every 2 hours. 

Ten o'clock at night there.  Good luck, Britons.  Thoughts and prayers.  Some real troopers. 

Apparently "officials" are expecting 750,000 people.  More than three times estimated by my back of the envelope math. 

I gotta say, the one thing I am happy to see is nobody trying to take a selfie. 

The grief is less evident today compared to yesterday, replaced with a kind of weariness and relief they have made it to the end. 

 

Grant

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #28 on: September 15, 2022, 10:41:37 PM »
It's 3:26 in the morning in London.  The Queue is still 4.9 miles long. Time is "at least" 11.5 hours. 

An individual getting into Westminster now has been in the queue since around noon yesterday. 

Grant

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #29 on: September 16, 2022, 10:19:02 AM »
"The queue is at capacity and entry is currently paused.  Please do not attempt to join until it resumes". 

Guess it is up to 6 or so miles, looking at the map? 

They're no longer just letting the lines be single file at the climax.  Each line is now three wide. 

It is now 3pm in London.  The weekend is approaching. 

The modern record for attendance at a funeral in Europe is Pope John Paul II in 2005, at 4 million people.  The Ayatollah Khomeini had approximately 10 million show up in 1989. 

If even 1 million attends the funeral of QEII, it would be 1.5% of the entire population of the United Kingdom.  Equivalent to 5 million people in the United States.

Tom

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #30 on: September 16, 2022, 10:53:02 AM »
I honestly cannot think of a politician to whom I am not related whose funeral I would attend.

Grant

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #31 on: September 16, 2022, 12:27:02 PM »
"Entry to the Queue has resumed.  Expected queuing time is over 24 hours.  Overnight temperatures will be cold." 

It is now 5pm in London.  Depending on who you ask, the weekend has begun.  Overnight temperatures will drop to 45 deg F.  9% chance of rain tomorrow. 

https://www.express.co.uk/news/royal/1669439/Queen-tracker-live-lying-in-state-queue-time-find-end-westminster-hall

Quote
Frustration has erupted among mourners, as the queue to see the Queen Lying-In-State has been closed for at least six hours and until the number of queuers is greatly reduced. Lionel Gilmartin, 64, and his wife Kaaron left their Manchester home at 7.30am to pay their respects to the Queen. The couple said they will ignore the official government announcement of the queue closure “until it comes from the horse’s mouth”. Lionel, told the Telegraph that the queuing system was a “complete shambles”. Hundreds of thousands of people have flocked to the capital to see the Queen's coffin in Westminster Hall and people from across the UK and the world have been queueing from as early as Monday to get in line on Albert Embankment.

Quote
Ambulance teams have treated 435 members of the public along the route of the queue to see the Queen's coffin since it opened at 5pm on Thursday.
The London Ambulance Service said some 291 people along the route of the queue and nearby in London were given medical assistance on Wednesday, with 17 needing hospital treatment.
A further 144 people were treated on Thursday, with 25 people being taken to hospital.
The majority of incidents attended were faints and collapses, resulting in head injuries.

Better than Mardi Gras. 

Individuals now risking their lives in the queue include David Beckham and the Prime Minister of New Zealand. 

I'm going to double down on the concept that if the Brits can make medals for coronations (they do), they should be making medals for this funeral and be handing them out to everyone who makes it out of Westminster. 

Grant

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #32 on: September 18, 2022, 11:44:21 AM »
"A decision will be taken today on when entry to the queue will close as it reaches final capacity.  To avoid disappointment please do not set off to join the queue". 

OK.  First I want to recognize that I have a problem.  But the good news is that this is self limiting. They're closing the queue.  They're going to put the lady into the ground.  And hopefully I can find something else to fill the void that has been taken up watching these people get to the end of the line.  But I will tell my grandchildren about this. 

So T-Time (ha ha) will be roughly 1200 Zulu.  It is now 4pm in London, so we are T minus 20h now.  So the queue will be closing probably soon.  At least by 3 to 6pm Romeo.  Interesting that I just learned that the UK has it's version of daylight savings time, called "summer time".  I actually like that better because I never have to look up to figure out if I am in daylight savings time or standard time. 

Hopefully no riots, but if you show up late you can always stay for the funeral procession. 

Some singles have formed some relationships.  I don't know if it's the best place to meet women in London but hey.

I suppose this is what it will look like at Barnes and Nobel when The Winds of Winter finally drops.  The line for The Deathly Hallows was fun but I feel I was maxed out there.


Tom

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #33 on: September 18, 2022, 12:35:57 PM »
I feel like they could have strapped each of the Queen's limbs to a drone and flown her around England to do home visits for about as much expense.

NobleHunter

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #34 on: September 18, 2022, 12:38:17 PM »
I think people would object to having the Queen quartered, even if she was dead first.

Grant

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #35 on: September 18, 2022, 01:04:30 PM »
I feel like they could have strapped each of the Queen's limbs to a drone and flown her around England to do home visits for about as much expense.

Tom is Anti-Beefeater and Anti-Constable and Pro-Dronepilot. 

Why do you hate Beefeaters, Tom? 

NobleHunter

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #36 on: September 18, 2022, 01:22:49 PM »
Don't attack Tom just for preferring a higher grade of Gin. Some people are picky about their spirits.

Grant

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #37 on: September 18, 2022, 02:58:29 PM »
Don't attack Tom just for preferring a higher grade of Gin. Some people are picky about their spirits.

Oh, now he's a toff.  I suppose he hates Budweiser too and only drinks Stella Artois or Peroni. 

NobleHunter

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #38 on: September 18, 2022, 03:25:13 PM »
It's not like there are good American beers.

TheDrake

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #39 on: September 18, 2022, 06:44:53 PM »
It's not like there are good American beers.

Oh stop. There are 2,538 breweries operating in the US. Well in 2013. Each of those have at least a half-dozen varieties.

Koenig is no better than Budweiser, if you want to focus on the largest garbage brands. Tsingtao is okay, but nothing special. Corona is *censored*tier than the vast majority of beer brewed in the US.

NobleHunter

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #40 on: September 18, 2022, 06:48:16 PM »
Hey, slagging on US beer is a Canadian pastime.

Grant

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #41 on: September 18, 2022, 10:05:43 PM »
Hey, slagging on US beer is a Canadian pastime.

Canada has won zero world wars or superbowls. 

Grant

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #42 on: September 18, 2022, 10:13:29 PM »
Well, "The queue to attend the lying-in-state is at final capacity and is now closed to new entrants.  Please do not attempt to join the queue". 

All world leaders were invited to the funeral, and will either attend or have a representative, except the following countries who were not invited:

Afghanistan
Venezuela
Myanmar
Syria
Belarus
Russia


They are of course free to have their own funeral.  The death of Pooter or Assad would certainly be a reason for festivities. 

Poor a cup out for that dude who showed up to the queue 10 seconds late.  Just don't pour out any Canadian beer.  I hear it would be classified as a toxic spill and need to be reported to the EPA or EA. 

NobleHunter

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #43 on: September 19, 2022, 08:29:57 AM »
Canada has won zero world wars or superbowls.

But we have won World Series and have good beer to celebrate it with.

ETA: You can pour out an American beer since it's like making love in a canoe.

Tom

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #44 on: September 19, 2022, 08:53:38 AM »
*laugh* I'll admit to preferring hard liquor to beer on those rare occasions when I drink anything alcoholic at all, but haven't found myself hurting for drinkable beers in south-central Wisconsin. That said, if there were some kind of strangely specific apocalypse and only Moulson or Budweiser were available, I'd obviously choose the former.

Grant

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #45 on: September 19, 2022, 09:42:42 AM »
Really disappointed that Leslie Jones isn't a commentator for this funeral.  Maybe she is live tweeting it. 

Nope.  Though she did livetweet last night's episode of HotD.  So she has her priorities.   

rightleft22

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #46 on: September 19, 2022, 09:46:22 AM »
Hey, slagging on US beer is a Canadian pastime.

Canada has won zero world wars or superbowls.

Not to derail the slagging :) but for the sake of remembrance of service it ought to be noted that Canada had 660,000+ who served in WW1 and over a million in WW2. Engaging in the wars before the US did.
 

jc44

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #47 on: September 19, 2022, 10:34:26 AM »
I've never forgiven the US Budweiser Corp for forcing the (original) Budweiser from České Budějovice to rename their beer.

NobleHunter

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #48 on: September 19, 2022, 10:39:43 AM »
I believe we can get real Budweiser in Canada.

I should look into that.

*laugh* I'll admit to preferring hard liquor to beer on those rare occasions when I drink anything alcoholic at all, but haven't found myself hurting for drinkable beers in south-central Wisconsin. That said, if there were some kind of strangely specific apocalypse and only Moulson or Budweiser were available, I'd obviously choose the former.

But do you have an opinion on gin? That's where this all started.

jc44

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Re: London Bridge is Falling?
« Reply #49 on: September 19, 2022, 10:46:01 AM »
I do have opinions on gin, but seeing as they are mostly small UK distillery opinions they won't translate well to your side of the pond. My greatest disappointment gin-wise was finding out that Bombay Saphire wasn't actually blue - it was just the bottle (otherwise its quite a nice gin).