Author Topic: The Obama Lovefest  (Read 1616 times)

Seriati

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The Obama Lovefest
« on: January 18, 2017, 01:02:26 PM »
Has there ever been a President whose received more unwarranted love than the exiting one from the media?

On the way into office, every article was spun about the savior replacing the evil George Bush.  Notwithstanding that President Obama had no real accomplishments to his name, he was promptly awarded the "You're not George Bush Nobel Peace Prize."  We heard nothing but how great of an inspiration he was.

Now, after 8 years of a middling to poor run as a President, we're getting a wall to wall love fest, to the point that his approval ratings are actually increasing, lol.  What did he accomplish?  Greater divisions than every, decline in the strength of his own party, international weakness and failures aplenty, and what do we get, an all media sources victory tour?

I don't know if the media and the collective group has ever had a more irrational reaction to a politician in history.

D.W.

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Re: The Obama Lovefest
« Reply #1 on: January 18, 2017, 01:30:42 PM »
While you do touch on a few good points, mostly you are re-writing history or viewing it through a much different lens then "the media".

I haven't made a point of tracking "unwarranted love" in past presidents.  I'd say Reagan would give Obama a serious run for his money in rear-view love fest.  As for the bizarre prognosticating forward view Peace Prize?  I got no idea...   :)

It's plausible someone else MAY have made been responsible for a bigger economic recovery.  It's plausible someone else MAY have made us more secure in the world.  Maybe someone else MAY have been better suited to improve race relations in our country. 

Actually, ya know what?  I think I begin to understand why Republicans fell for Trump.  He's a man of superlatives.  And it seems, that's what we want.  MORE, BETTER, THE BEST! 

Doing the job of being president well, and (at least IMO) improving it overall, from what we started with at the beginning of his term, was never going to be enough for them.

scifibum

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Re: The Obama Lovefest
« Reply #2 on: January 18, 2017, 04:34:53 PM »
Yeah, it does turn out that the GOP's full court press of obstructionism, suspicion, and derision worked in a few ways.  It limited what Obama could get done, it sabotaged things that could have worked much better than they did, it kept ignorant voters convinced that Obama was literally an enemy of the American people, and it demonstrated that the federal government was dysfunctional (clearly demonstrating, in some way for some people, that electing more of the people who were throwing sand in the gears was a good option - although we have to give the GOP credit for gerrymandering much of their own success here).

Still, he held it together better than most people saddled with his opposition would have done, and accelerated some of the movement toward improved justice for people who have been marginalized.  He inspired millions of people in ways that will pay dividends for a very long time.  If you think that sounds stupid, I think you lack heart.

But the biggest reason he's getting a lot of love right now: there's nothing to improve your opinion of the current boss like confronting the reality of a much worse boss. 

JoshCrow

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Re: The Obama Lovefest
« Reply #3 on: January 18, 2017, 06:15:47 PM »
Class. Intelligence. Dignity. The man was presidential. Whether or not one agrees with him, at the very least he seemed a person who would consider things carefully and who might even listen to your position. He might do something differently than you'd want, but it isn't because he hasn't thought about it or about the other side of things.

Also, as scifi rightly pointed out, there's nothing quite like seeing the alternatives to put things in perspective.

He'll be remembered as the Jackie Robinson of politics and will be for Democrats the kind of figure Reagan was for Republicans. I can only hope that 30 years on people won't distort him the way Reagan has been distorted by the current crop... revered only in nostalgia rather than in policy.

TheDeamon

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Re: The Obama Lovefest
« Reply #4 on: January 18, 2017, 09:06:55 PM »
Class. Intelligence. Dignity. The man was presidential. Whether or not one agrees with him, at the very least he seemed a person who would consider things carefully and who might even listen to your position. He might do something differently than you'd want, but it isn't because he hasn't thought about it or about the other side of things.

I'm more inclined to think he might go the way of Woodrow Wilson. Of course, the thing that would be interesting, is to see what his Presidential Library releases in the next 30+ years.

I'm more inclined to think to think that history may not be so kind to Mr. Obama once more of the story of what happened behind closed doors comes out. Well, if it ever does. Considering the Republicans still have no idea what Obama was doing on the night of the Benghazi attack, and not for lack of trying.

Kasandra

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Re: The Obama Lovefest
« Reply #5 on: January 18, 2017, 09:11:58 PM »
Class. Intelligence. Dignity. The man was presidential. Whether or not one agrees with him, at the very least he seemed a person who would consider things carefully and who might even listen to your position. He might do something differently than you'd want, but it isn't because he hasn't thought about it or about the other side of things.

I'm more inclined to think he might go the way of Woodrow Wilson. Of course, the thing that would be interesting, is to see what his Presidential Library releases in the next 30+ years.

I'm more inclined to think to think that history may not be so kind to Mr. Obama once more of the story of what happened behind closed doors comes out. Well, if it ever does. Considering the Republicans still have no idea what Obama was doing on the night of the Benghazi attack, and not for lack of trying.
So, would you say that Bush II was a better President than Obama?  If so, explain why.

TheDeamon

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Re: The Obama Lovefest
« Reply #6 on: January 18, 2017, 09:37:54 PM »
Bush 43 ("Bush II") is complicated. Are we talking domestic or foreign policy? Or a hybrid of both?

Foreign policy, he's doomed because Obama effectively derailed many of his ongoing efforts which were starting to work as he left office, so nothing conclusive can be claimed in either direction. Other than he had some spectacular failures during his first term, to say the least.

Domestically, he was largely forgettable, although rather centrist all things considered. Many of the things he took so much political flak over continued under Obama and remain in place today. Arguably, his administration policies set the (final) stage for the bubble we saw pop in 2008, which in turn created the environment for "the great recession" of the Obama years. Bush 43(or "Bush II") is likely to be recorded as a mediocre and below average presidency all things considered. I do think his initial ranking as being among the worst was undeserved, but we're also still only 8 years out from his Presidency, it'll likely be another 12 years or so until his positioning really settles out among his predecessors, never mind the ones after him.

But just as Bush 43 was ranked harshly, I think Obama is going to be getting ranked through rose-tinted glasses by many, so we're going to see the press talk about him being highly ranked/rated "by Historians" here soon. His ranking among the 44 Presidents prior to him is only going to go down from there as time moves on and people get more perspective on what went on during his tenure. Obama was a mediocre 2 term president, and I'd be willing to bet that he's not going to be listed very far away from Bush 43 by most Historians about 30 years from now.

Fenring

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Re: The Obama Lovefest
« Reply #7 on: January 19, 2017, 12:27:46 AM »
Foreign policy, he's doomed because Obama effectively derailed many of his ongoing efforts which were starting to work as he left office, so nothing conclusive can be claimed in either direction.

I'm no Obama fan, but sorry - this is ridiculous. You can blame Obama for anything you want during his term, but blaming him retroactively for disastrous things W did on account that their effects didn't magically vanish when Obama took office is just tomfoolery.

TheDeamon

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Re: The Obama Lovefest
« Reply #8 on: January 19, 2017, 12:57:27 AM »
Foreign policy, he's doomed because Obama effectively derailed many of his ongoing efforts which were starting to work as he left office, so nothing conclusive can be claimed in either direction.

I'm no Obama fan, but sorry - this is ridiculous. You can blame Obama for anything you want during his term, but blaming him retroactively for disastrous things W did on account that their effects didn't magically vanish when Obama took office is just tomfoolery.

Which goes to Bush's "spectacular failures" in his first term. He looked like a path to redemption laid out in his second term, we had a stable (but occupied) Iraq, a situation in Afghanistan that was improving incrementally, and a somewhat stable middle east situation. Albeit, Bush undermined some of that himself when his admin helped set the stage for our drawdown/withdrawal from Iraq, which happened too quickly, even according to reports at the time. But the politics of the move supported it, and by the time that call was being made, Obama was in office and his politics was all about GTFO ASAP, which was the wrong call. It is unknown what a Republican Admin under McCain would have done, although a "Third Term Bush Admin" probably would have pushed for keeping boots on the ground in Iraq upon realizing the prior agreement was a train wreck waiting to happen, the Bush Team had already gone against public opinion to stabilize things as it was(in late 2008) in the first place, so it wouldn't be unprecedented.

Then we had the "Arab Spring" which can arguably be claimed as a powder keg created by Bush, but it was one that Obama poured gasoline on. It rendered moot the gains the Bush Admin had made in Libya, Egypt, and Syria, and made things arguably much worse for the people in those nations as a consequence. The Obama Admin then called ISIS/ISIL "The JV Team" much to their later regret.

And if you paid attention, I said "Bush was doomed" because of what followed. His first term created a mess, his second term started the cleanup, only for the next guy(Obama) to come along and screw things up even more in the Middle East.

I still stand by the assessment that in 20 to 30 years, Obama and Bush are likely to be (near) neighbors on the rankings of best/worst U.S. Presidents in (recent) History, with Obama likely to be ranked just ahead of Bush. There might be a (prior) president who falls in between them ranking wise, but I'm not sure who that would be right now.

But just as I'm also denigrating Bush in this post for consequences of his actions that had impacts on Obama, there are consequences of things Obama has done that we're unaware of just yet, so his ranking is uncertain at present. However, I doubt many of his currently "unknowns consequences" are going to be considered positive by most once encountered and identified.

Also as an extension of some logic employed, yes, I'm leaving open the option that "Obama Care" might have worked out better in the Democrat form vs whatever the Republicans may turn it into in the next couple of years. Which means the Dems have "an out" on saying "Well, if the Republicans hadn't done ____ then this wouldn't be a problem now."