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Messages - rightleft22

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General Comments / Re: Trump's views on Russia
« on: July 28, 2016, 02:34:52 PM »
"Are you saying you don't think this already happens,"

Not relevant to the question.

Though I could rephrase
If Trump is ok with foreign nationals hacking American citizens would Trump make such actions openly legal for government agencies
As commander and chief would trump defend American from Foreign cyber attacks.

General Comments / Re: Trump's views on Russia
« on: July 28, 2016, 10:14:03 AM »
Disregarding the email scandal or legality of hacking.

Is it ok that the candidate for the precedency ask a foreign power to hack another candidate’s email even if the emails no longer exist?

If Trump is ok with foreign nationals hacking American citizens Is Trump implying that he would be ok and even encourage government spying on citizens and if he could get away with it would disregard privacy laws and or change them to suit his purpose

General Comments / Re: Update on Thing Two
« on: July 27, 2016, 12:59:21 PM »
Sorry to hear about the challenge you are facing.

Not that this has anything to do with your post

Currently reading Language Arts by Stephanie Kallos about a father with a autistic child  and "how we communicate with or without language, how we connect with other human beings"
Its a slow start but well worth pushing through and its made me rethink or re-imagine what it might mean to raise a child that you can't communicate with.

Also re-reading Philip Simmons 'Learning to Fall: The Blessings of an Imperfect Life'  because I don't understand why these things happen.


General Comments / Re: michael Moore predicts Trump victory
« on: July 22, 2016, 06:21:49 PM »
To clarify my remarks

I'm not saying that if someone was justifying there support of Hillary in the same manner that that would be ok. I am not hearing that kind of justification  coming from her supporters, however I may not be noticing for the noise that Trump makes.

I find the arguments and justifications people are using are not rational and find the type of discourse frightening. I know I"m not explaining myself very well...

Trump lies but Hillary is a lyer , Trump bully's but isn't a bully, Hilary bullies and is a bully What sticks on Hillary does not stick on Trump. What sticks on any other politicians does not stick on Trump and that to my mind is dangerous

What Trump represents physiologically is dangerous. Take out the labels of democrat or republican, watch him, listen to him and how people respond to him. Who they become. It isn't political, what I'm saying isn't political. Hilary maybe a bad person who time ought to have passed, but something about Trump is... off

I don't see this ending well

Has Trump read the papers on TPP?

General Comments / Re: michael Moore predicts Trump victory
« on: July 22, 2016, 02:57:39 PM »
II'm not good at this form of communication. I know what I want to say but can't say it
I give up

We get the people leading us that we deserve.   

General Comments / Re: michael Moore predicts Trump victory
« on: July 22, 2016, 01:43:41 PM »
So your ok with a man like Trump being your voice??

General Comments / Re: michael Moore predicts Trump victory
« on: July 22, 2016, 01:00:26 PM »

General Comments / Re: GOP convention
« on: July 22, 2016, 11:28:53 AM »
 "Trump may have falsely characterized Cruz as a liar, but Hillary is a real liar"

??? You can forgive one liar  or curtain kind of liars by qualify what a "real lie" is.
Your lying to yourself wake up

General Comments / Re: michael Moore predicts Trump victory
« on: July 22, 2016, 10:35:06 AM »
“One of the things I’ve been concerned about this week is we’re all sitting in our bubble, having a good laugh at this total, as you said, *censored*show, but the truth is that this plays to a lot of people” 

We don’t learn from history so Moore is probably right.

And no I’m not comparing Trump to Hitler, Franko or Mussolini but referring to the campaign of the theater of exceptionalism(nationalism), us them, fear, blame, anti-intellectualism, and a population manipulated to overlook character that put such men (who prey on fear) in power.

And then when history looks back on such moments they mention how the establishment failed to take such men seriously, and thought they could manage them, and how the majority of the people looked away and "let" *censored* happen stunned like a dear in headlights.

It boggles the mind that a person can overlook the character of a man

If I hear one more time someone say that yes they have concerns about his political, professional, personas but apparently his one on one and family man personas are great so sure I can support him. Oh but when it comes to the other leaders character, well that’s all that matters. How does Trumpism do that? Why are so many people falling for it?

When does it mean when you boo the statement “vote you’re conscious”.  A subliminal suggestion that the mob isn’t’ voting consciously!!! Its all shadow! (the image of Trump first appearance at the RNC as the emerging larger then life shadow should scare the crap out of everyone!)

You want big government intervention, you want freedom by limiting freedom (freedom for the angry white man anyway) Vote for Trump he’s your voice.  He’s your fracking Voice!!! Do you hear the crap your saying, what you’re really saying!  what you really are standing for! Wake UP!!!

General Comments / Re: Is Trevor Noah supposed to be a comedian?
« on: July 21, 2016, 09:54:39 AM »
One of course must make as an informed decision as possible and vote ones conscious.

Noah’s statement that a not voting or protest vote will benefit Trump is I think a factor to be considered in making an informed decision and so factor into one conscious

Personally I suspect Noah is right as can be seen by how Trump won the nomination.

“but neither do I want to have to say "Yeah, I voted for him/her" for the next four years. Yup, that's my President, I picked her. You have me to thank. Because that's what voting for somebody means - you picked them. You own their mistakes and their bad ideas.”

I don’t buy that thinking.  The People are the government and will be held responsible no matter who they vote for. 

Off topic and I’m not saying Trump is a Fascist or holds such political ambitions… but dang his communication style, theater, mannerisms, movement, facial expressions all I see is Mussolini.

General Comments / Re: "Making America Great Again" in The Newsroom
« on: July 20, 2016, 02:25:25 PM »
What happened?

Pre 9-11 I have a sense that in general people were becoming more conscious and learning how to respond to events instead of react to them. There was an optimism even when crap happened.
Or was that just an illusion of innocents on my part that time always erodes.

What was this greatness that we were/are seeking that is no more?

If the philosophers are correct then character is an important quality of greatness for a leader and people. If character is what we admire about the greatness past how can a leader that does not demonstrate character in their actions or words re-create this greatness?

I am totally genuinely perplexed.

General Comments / Re: Is Trevor Noah supposed to be a comedian?
« on: July 20, 2016, 02:00:12 PM »
In this election cycle any protest vote looks like will it will favor Trump as more democrats are indicating that they will not support the party with Hillary as the figure head.

That is not a statement about a protest vote being a moral right or wrong thing to do but something a voter should consider.

I guess if a voter views both Trump and Hillary as equivalent then that could be a justification of letting what will happen happen however I’m not so sure in a two party system how responsible that is.

Personally I find it lazy as the policies and intention outlined by the two parties differ quite a bit.

Then I find the American election process overly convoluted and I’m not sure how democratic a two party system can be so maybe we should let it burn. 

General Comments / Re: "Making America Great Again" in The Newsroom
« on: July 20, 2016, 10:55:06 AM »
When people use words like greatness and freedom I never know what they mean anymore. Perhaps that’s the difference. Maybe the greatest generation, which would never have thought of themselves in that way while they were serving, had a clearer vision of what the word pointed at – and that it required having character.

Today I think the word greatness is associated with the word power to control. To be great… again is to be free to be free is to be able to control… Any time we protect freedom we must at the same time restrict it. (Perhaps that’s why that even though republican’s primary intention is limiting government the government grows larger when they are in power.  Just think how much Government intervention would be required to fulfill the agenda of Trump. )

Would such government intervention in the name of ‘protecting’ freedom in such a way be great… again? 

When character no longer matters. When a man is admired because “he says it like he sees it”, even though to do so he misrepresents facts, outright lies, focus on the negative, bully’s and never actually says anything. Is that great… again?

How does having supporters that don’t care enough to read the platform there party is presenting (why would they when even the leader of a party doesn’t care what written in the platform) make America great…. again.  Supporters that will forgive any transgression of their leader that they would not and will not tolerate coming from anyone else….  What the frack is going on!!!! How do you become great… again without character?   

America is playing with fire.

Greatness like Freedom are words that no longer point to anything, no longer a symbol or ideal to strive for, but a manipulation, the map becoming the territory that takes you nowhere.

And what is it with this attraction the world seems to have to men with strange grooming styles and gestures seeking power?  Never turns out well.

It was very appropriate that Trump emerged on stage of the GOP convention as a shadow

General Comments / Re: Is Trevor Noah supposed to be a comedian?
« on: July 19, 2016, 03:31:18 PM »
I suspect that is what Noah is worried about.
Any protest vote or voter that stays home will favor Trump.

General Comments / Re: Chilcot
« on: July 19, 2016, 03:12:07 PM »
Osama Bin Laden is laughing fear is winning

General Comments / Re: Chilcot
« on: July 19, 2016, 12:56:07 PM »
it squirrel not bird  ::)

General Comments / Re: Is Trevor Noah supposed to be a comedian?
« on: July 19, 2016, 10:47:52 AM »
Not sure I would use the words - Manipulate or coerce

“Let’s not beat around the bush — not voting is voting.” Is a statement of fact. 

In the Brexit how many of the voters that wanted to stay didn't vote and woke up the next morning going wtf

My feeling is that Trevor was responding to the reality that people are stupid and to often chose by not choosing.

Agree though that Noah is not funny

General Comments / Re: Reality sets in
« on: July 18, 2016, 04:08:47 PM »
Trump is in way over his head

General Comments / Re: Good thing Micah johnson only used guns
« on: July 15, 2016, 10:32:39 AM »
I don’t understand.

Are you saying that because a person used a truck as a weapon any argument supporting gun regulation becomes void?
OR are you saying that those supporting gun regulation must now come out and argue for new truck regulation.
Implying that this event can be used as an example of how registering, insuring, training and requiring license to operate a truck proves that gun regulation will not work.

General Comments / Re: Avoiding police
« on: July 14, 2016, 04:10:31 PM »
I agree with TheDeamon negative experience tend to stick in memory more then the  positive .

I think officers on the street spend a lot of time dealing with drunks and the belligerent.
I spent a summer as a security guard working downtown at night... not fun

General Comments / Re: Avoiding police
« on: July 14, 2016, 03:36:21 PM »
When I joined the military pretty much everyone I worked with started out with the intention or hope, often naive, of the ideal of service and making a difference as being one of the reasons for joining.
Overtime, for various reasons, maintaining that sense of service dissipates and more often than not a cynicism replaced it which to often impacted quality of work. 

I think we forget that police officers interact with people at their worst and or experiencing their worst situations and that it would take a super human efforts for such interactions not to affect their world view. 

That of course does not excuse unacceptable responses (or more likely reactions) to those they deal with.

General Comments / Re: Avoiding police
« on: July 14, 2016, 03:30:59 PM »
In traffic court.... how you interacted with the officer will be part of the officers notes.
If the judge allows that to influence him or her I don't know

General Comments / Re: Avoiding police
« on: July 14, 2016, 03:03:10 PM »
Any answer you give the cop to those types of questions may as they say be used against you.
The correct answer is yes I was doing the speed limit.

I agree Seriati and would add that by the time information is vetted (if it’s ever vetted) and the facts corrected the media and people have moved on to the next so the initial impression of the dis-information remains in most people’s minds so the real issues are seldom addressed.

Is there litigation risks for the media reporting incorrect information and has any media outlet been held accountable.

The rise of the 24 hour news coverage has lead to the fall of quality news journalism. 
The rush to “report” live ends with hours of non-news reporting and conjecture that the public is all too ready to react to instead of respond.

The Medias mandate ought to be to sort out the chafe from the wheat, instead the owners who are more interested in spin to support their editorial bias while keeping viewers watching/entertained. 

We live in the information age when you can’t trust the information?
By the time the chafe is sorted the next event is already happening and no one cares to change there talking points but if you do care you’re labeled an intellectual and dismissed.

Nothing is going to change

General Comments / Re: Is Clinton likely to face charges of perjury?
« on: July 07, 2016, 10:12:03 AM »
What a stupid scandal

Neither Clinton nor Trump are fit to lead

This is the predictable result of all of the hate that is being directed at Trump

What is predictable is that we create what we fear and a political movement that is wholly based on the negative can create nothing else. Trump appears to not care or just ignorant of what his movement may be creating.

IMO Trumps speeches come from a base of fear and projection which IMO can end only in hate and negatively influence those in society that are less grounded. 

The Trump origination has a way of spinning the narrative like no other. Without ever saying anything of substance, the mud flies off and hits all those around.

Yet because I hate that style of dialog if I express it, I am the hater… and responsible for what that tye of dialog creates???

General Comments / Re: A thoughtful defense of voting for trump
« on: June 30, 2016, 02:35:09 PM »
would you get more traction by calling him a racist (which he doubtlessly was) or by publicly showing that his arguments were fallacious and his facts fiction?

This is what I don't understand we are no longer trying to to show or seem to care that arguments are fact fictions and seem to be ok with that????

Trump can "tell it like it is" and because its not politically correct it does not mater if what he says is not true to fact.

In the recent Brexit campaign the backlash of political correctness had more of an impact on the vote then the correctness of facts. the exit campaign deliberately misrepresent "facts"...
keeping the debate as far from facts and actual plans on how the UK would leave and what doing so would look like.
Anyone attempting to bring the debate to real issues was labeled a intellectual elite which ended the debate.
What the UK got was a reaction to feeling instead of a response based on thinking.

General Comments / Re: A thoughtful defense of voting for trump
« on: June 30, 2016, 01:56:47 PM »
So the problem here isn’t an issue of political correctness but a failure in the education system in regards to debate and the understanding of “semantic reactions” (Science and Sanity)

yelling "na na na na na!" is no longer a debate or making a argument about a position

General Comments / Re: A thoughtful defense of voting for trump
« on: June 30, 2016, 01:15:26 PM »
Calling someone by a judgmental name just because you don't like them is not nice…

Are we assuming that the person in the example is being called a racist because the other person doesn’t like him and wants to shut them down?

Perhaps the dialog should be clearer and the remarks qualified by saying that what is being said, the words being used to make the argument – all green men are rapists – is an argument of race.
(And in doing so conform to the convention of political correctness – label the sin not the sinner) So one again we are back to where we started

If I make an argument that founded on the concept of race can I be called a racist?
Should calling me a racist shut down the debate or is it a call to go deeper?

General Comments / Re: A thoughtful defense of voting for trump
« on: June 30, 2016, 12:14:26 PM »
I assume that your assumption is correct which is what does not make sense to me.

This guy is saying that he wants to be protected from being called a racist for speaking his mind… for example saying something like all green people are inbreed murders and rapists because they are green and come for country X without being labeled a racist. 

Essentially he wants to be protected from being labeled while free to label because its “as he sees it”.  Free from being offended while free to offend.

And that this issue of political correctness, whatever that is, is more important then matters of Character and if what is actually being said is true or not.

General Comments / Re: A thoughtful defense of voting for trump
« on: June 30, 2016, 11:55:40 AM »
So electing Trump will stop other people from labeling those that disagree with as racist or such

General Comments / Re: A thoughtful defense of voting for trump
« on: June 30, 2016, 11:06:41 AM »
When did the ability to speak and debate without intentionally being offensive become offensive?

What happens when being politically incorrect becomes politically correct?

From the Article

“The young man explained why he was willing to overlook that behavior….
30 Trump supporters explaining their support. A backlash against “political correctness” loomed large in those accounts.”

“Having Trump in the White House would both give me more confidence to speak my own opinion and more of a shield from instantly being dismissed as a racist/xenophobe/Nazi (all three things I have been called personally”

I don’t understand the logic... I don’t understand the words “political correctness”.

I don't understand anything....

What happens in a world where saying whatever you want in as offensive language that you chose without regard to factual correctness becomes politically correct? 

I suspect Trump would authentically apply the label Christian to himself but doubt he would pursue the question any deeper than the label.  - You are what you label yourself – everything tweeted is true… unless you don’t like it.

Trump may also believe that he wants to be President and not just win the label president… I doubt he understands there is a difference.

General Comments / Re: Orlando massacre
« on: June 14, 2016, 11:43:25 AM »
As we learn more about Mateen I suspect we will find that his linking the event to Issis was physiological, an attempt to justify his actions to himself due to an inability to accept his sexuality. 

General Comments / Re: I may have to vote for Trump
« on: June 09, 2016, 01:24:37 PM »
America is hooped - to choices that no one trusts
You need a third party at least

General Comments / Re: I may have to vote for Trump
« on: May 30, 2016, 09:55:45 AM »
You give Trump to much credit if you think he plans to say what he says and if he has a strategy it’s to manipulating the worst in people.

Trump lives in the now. Not the Buddhist concept of the now of mindfulness, but his now. What he thinks/does now is THE Truth. What he selectively reads or hears from 'His' 140 character limit universe is true.

If Trump becomes president can you invasion this man inspiring Americans in a positive way?

Shame on anyone who considers this man worthy of being the leader of the United States.

That’s the scary thing with madness there is no method or meaning to it.

It couldn't be that they oppose autocratic dictates from any President, or that they are fundamentally opposed to the kind of sweeping policy reforms that he has proposed and implemented

The policy by the GOP to obstruct everything coming from the White House was made in meetings days after McCain lost the election - before Obama took office in 2008.

Perhaps in anticipation that he would be an autocratic president looking to implement sweeping policy reforms…  Bull Crap - Though no doubt this is what they convinced themselves of.

In the light of such obstructionism any policy that the White House managed to get though could only be labeled as autocratic and sweeping by the opposition… whatever the ‘sweeping’ policies were. 

The GOP is very effective in spinning a situation they effectively created and now look who leads them.
History will not be kind

The GOP lost its way when the only thing that matters to them is that the Party Wins. Trump is a winner, win win win

“The election of a black President induced Republicans to throw gasoline on the racist kindling they’ve nurtured for decades. When democrats became the party of equal rights for blacks in the mid-sixties, racists sought a new home. They found it with Republicans; and Republicans have been quite mindful of that audience ever since.

Republicans recognized in the mid-sixties that the American Id—which lives in everyone raised within American history and culture—is a Klansman. Modern Republicans provoke that Id like lap dances provoke erections—and with just as much class.”

The GOP deliberate adoption of obstructionism in dealing with a Popular Black Democrat President, a policy made before he even took office, was and continues to be, at its foundation racist.

You reap what you sow, the rise of a ‘Reality TV’ nomine leading the GOP. 

General Comments / Re: I may have to vote for Trump
« on: May 26, 2016, 12:57:25 PM »
How can anyone support a person with such poor character qualities.
You would think that a country like the USA would have better choices

General Comments / Re: I may have to vote for Trump
« on: May 13, 2016, 04:02:27 PM »
I can understand the frustration (not so much the anger) but how does supporting a man like Trump address that frustration and anger?

It’s not a rational response to that anger more IMO a “cut off your nose to spite your face” kind of thing

General Comments / Re: I may have to vote for Trump
« on: May 10, 2016, 10:15:32 AM »
Politics as a reality game show, a mix of survivor and apprentice. Trump seems to have learned a lot from the worst of those who play the game.
Sad that so many Americans are falling for the entertainment of it   

General Comments / Re: Will our opinions change by May 2017?
« on: April 08, 2016, 01:00:27 PM »
I am a Social Conservative  so today the label Democrat or Republican doesn't really fit anymore.

That said the Republicans should be my party but they have strayed to far. Not just Policies but more so in method. There tactics disgust me. 

Even though both sides use questionable tactics in my view the GOP are far more regimented about it. That the Democrats and Republicans might resort to the same tactics is a stupid validation or negation of the argument, any argument.

The difference as I see it, is that obstructionism for the GOP was not rhetoric but as stated intention/tacit that became fundamental to every decision they would make while Obama was in office.
It was a calculated decision intended to create a environment where they might win the next time.

General Comments / Re: Will our opinions change by May 2017?
« on: April 08, 2016, 10:46:17 AM »
Before Obama took office the GOP stated categorically that it would oppose anything that his administration would attempt to achieve.  This was the tactic I was referring to and which you asked for

They were not shy about proclaiming there opposition to Obama without regard to policy.
And many were not shy in proclaiming that their Goal was to insure that the Obama administration failed. Not that America succeed but Obama fail. They were very black and white statements and intentions

Oh and I am Conservative

General Comments / Re: Will our opinions change by May 2017?
« on: April 08, 2016, 10:20:22 AM »
When Obama took power the GOP vowed to obstruct anything that the administration put forward regardless of the merits. The goal was not to participate in governance for the good of the American people but to prepare the way for the next election cycle.

Too many carrier politicians believing that what is good for them must be good for the Party which will be good for American people. The goal become not good governance but winning and career.

Of course if the GOP win and end up facing the same type of obstructionism they will cry of the unfairness of it all.   

It is my opinion that the roots of the obstructionism by the GOP was racism and that much of Trumps support is generated from that subconscious ID.

General Comments / Re: What I find disturbing about Trump...
« on: March 22, 2016, 10:40:08 AM »
Yes, I'm giving him credit. He's been running a highly effective campaign.

What I find troubling are those that would condone and give credit to methods that appear to get the job of ‘winning’ done without evaluating the methods and the seeds those methods are planting. 

In another thread I rather badly associated Trump to Mussolini.  My intent was not political comparison but a comparison in style, rhetoric and method. One just has to watch or listen to each to see how closely they mirror each other.

Another similarity is that Mussolini defined Fascism as he went along just Trump is defining ‘Trumpism’ a political ideology of ‘winning’. (Once can’t help wonder if Trumps holds to a narcissistic belief that if he Wins, America wins, what is good for Trump is good for America.  And sometimes if you watch him closely there are moments where I wonder if he’s not scaring himself – what if he wins does he really want the job or just the title and foot note in history??)

Mussolini was very effective, and for a time he was a ‘winner’ but today history would not give him or his methods much credit

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